Hello,
So I just bought the beginner’s flute course off scoiltrad.
Frist two lessons were great… but that’s it.
Can someone please tell me where my other 8 lessons are?
Only two classes are downloaded and the links on the internet program just turn up Error messages for everything other than the first two.
I e-mailed scoiltrad, but I heard from one or two of you that I might not be hearing back too soon.
So did I pay $130 US to learn how to do the D and G scale? Pllllleaaasssseee say no. 
Ummm, the jury is still kind of out on that one.
Some folks have had great success with them; others have not. Some get through and others just . . . don’t. Certainly, anyone who HAS had success might want to assist those who have not by intervening on their behalf. Please! Perhaps you could ask one of them to stop by the boards and collect up the names of those who are in limbo?
It’s been so long since Conal’s been over here that I’ve been fearing he’s had some sort of personal tragedy.
You can relax about your missing lessons, because they’re not really “missing.” If you do a search of the board, you’ll see that Conal O’Grada says that he will send the links to your next lessons when you submit your assessment. This is to prevent you from swooshing ahead and missing the important points.
As an internet-based instructor, I can see the rationale, and confess to employing it myself. However, I have an able assistant at the school who rides herd on me, and a computer guru who rides herd on the server, and although we have little glitches from time to time, things work out. Definitely, students have more than one way of getting in touch with us. I couldn’t disappear even in those hurricanes we had.
Not that I really want to send in an assessment. No. But, in the interest of developing empathy with my students’ plight, I expect I will.
Do let us know how you manage to contact them, won’t you?
Thanks Peggy.
I don’t suppose it says that on their website anywhere does it? I was under the impressiong that the assessments aren’t mandatory. Just curious because I sent them an e-mail and I hope I don’t look like an idiot.
Well, hopefully they’re around to answer my e-mail. Thanks again.
I emailed, I phoned, I had friends email them on my behalf, and in 8 weeks I got no response whatsoever. I’ve applied to Visa for a full refund. Hope you have much better luck with them than I did.
If it says it, I didn’t find it. I did find that assessments were optional, leading me to believe that they were . . . optional.
Just curious . . . has any C&F’er actually done the package of beginner flute lessons? ALL of them? Three through ten?
I’m wondering if they just haven’t gotten around to finishing them up.
I had way better luck with MadforTrad.
Dang. Keep your fingers crossed for me. $130 is a bit of money for a Uni student.
Coming from the Visa world (although I’m in Canada, I believe the rules are the same everywhere), you probably won’t have Visa’s assistance. Their take is that the agreement was between you and the merchant, and if the merchant isn’t delivering the goods, you have to take it up with the merchant.
In other words, you authorized the merchant to charge you, therefore Visa processed the charge. If you hadn’t authorized it, Visa would take care of it for you and remove it from your account.
But in your case, your dispute is with the merchant, not with Visa…
However, I could be wrong. Some banks do a “good will” gesture for their clients, once in a while, and gladly reverse a nuisance of a charge for their clients. But that means the bank is out the money, through no fault of their own.
If your bank does that for you, be very thankful. 
Looks like you’re gonna have to go do some ‘collecting’ Gary since you’re closer. Don’t forget mine!
In the US, if you buy something, and it doesn’t arrive, or you dont’ get what you paid for, you can certainly apply for a full refund from the credit card company (VISA, MC, etC) and get one.
Moxy, I found this on the Canadian VISA site
http://www.visa.ca/en/personal/shop_epromise.cfm
Have any info?
I’ve found that pretty much anything a bank tells you they can or can’t do is provisional, and that polite persistance can usually bring them to change their minds.
If what you’re asking seems reasonable to you, it is probably possible to get a bank to agree to do it, whatever they tell you the rules say. The person you’re talking to may not have the authority to override, but someone does, and if you keep at it you’ll end up talking to that person.
It’s the same with universities, btw. Everything is up for negotiation, rules or no rules, but they won’t tell you that.
In dealing with credit card companies, phone companies, the Internal Revenue Service, etc., I’ve found the most effective words I can say are, “May I please speak to your supervisor.”
In many cases, the person who first handles a call is trained to say no, and on questioning will insist that they can’t do what you ask. I’ve even had them say that their supervisor will not be able to do what I was asking, either, but then that turned out not to be true.
I’ve found that the first person’s “no” is very often not the final answer at all and that someone further up the heirarchy is perfectly willing to accommodate a request.
Best wishes,
Jerry
Exactly. You don’t want to get their backs up, but you do want to convey the message that you’re not going away until they accomodate your reasonable request.
Use the “may I speak to your supervisor” line judiciously, because that’s calling the person you’re talking to a powerless peon, and even if it’s true it stings when you hear it.
If it’s a call centre you’re talking to, the buzzword you want is “escallate”–that’s call centre jargon for punting the call to a higher-up, who might actually be able to say yes or to deviate from the script.
Yep… what happens is they put the money in nowhere land and start an investigation. American Express is the easiest to deal with, but Visa is certainly doable. I’ve been able to cancel charges for stuff i didn’t really buy (errors), more than once.
Scoiltrad used to work very well, though. I don’t know what the heck happened. I hope Conal is OK.
I’ve never heard of the E-Promise, but they say this: “* Applies where the cardholder has lawfully cancelled his agreement with an online, phone or mail-order merchant; or the item received is different from what was ordered.”
I’d have to read it again, to be sure, but sounds like if you cancelled a subscription or an agreement, lawfully (Visa would require a copy of the cancellation before reversing charges), or if it’s that you got something other than what you ordered, then they will reverse charges (they charge back the merchant).
You might have a case there, OTM.
“May I speak to your supervisor” doesn’t always work. I’ve trained my agents to tell the truth to the cardholders, and I’ve given them the same powers I have for making any adjustments to their Visa accounts. I don’t have more powers than they do, and they always end up resolving any issues immediately as a first point of contact - no escalation necessary.
Our centre has become a lot more customer-service oriented, and our agents (not only mine, but in other departments too) are trained to have all the tools necessary for resolving all client concerns and complaints. If the call is going to a higher up, it’s only because the client really thinks they’ll get more if they continue to complain. Many times, all the client gets is another person to talk to, and sometimes that makes all the difference - the outcome on the account doesn’t necessarily change but the client feels good that they at least tried - plus they get the same response, but in different words.
The psychology of it is all beyond me, let me tell you. Just keep in mind that credit card money is not actually yours…
I hope Conal is OK.
Yes, that’s the worrisome part. He hasn’t posted here for a while. Up to several months ago, he was a fairly regular participant. Always positive and encouraging, so it’s something to be missed. 
OntheMoor, you might want to search for Conal’s past postings. There are five pages of posts indexed. Search for Conal as author and they’ll come up.
He does offer a good bit of useful and interesting information. It might give you something to work with while you wait. There is even advice about holding your flute and, something that you might find really interesting at this stage, pushing more air into the flute to develop better sound.
Re Visa… Here in the UK they’ve been very helpful, particularly since the purchase was made via the internet (Barclaycard have made a big thing about insuring internet purchases). All I had to do was tick a box, sign a form, and provide copies of emails and such for the claim of “Goods and services not supplied.” Of course, whether the $130 gets credited back to my account remains to be seen, but I’ll let you know if and when it is.
Hi OntheMoor,
I’ve purchased eight Scoiltrad since 2000 but never the courses, always the individual lessons and I haven’t had a problem. Best case scenario would be to call up and get them to give you eight codes ( for each tune ) after they’ve confirmed payment of course..that-a-way you download each lesson indivually as opposed to the entire course. They should not have a problem with this if you’ve already paid through Pay-Pal.
I’m not sure if they’ve got this whole “course” thing down-padded" yet, but try that. There is also the point of “you pay less in bulk than individual” , you’ll have to take that up with them.
Good luck with your efforts..
upiper71
Montreal
Thanks guys,
Yeah i would not particularly care if I could not use the assessment option because they were unavailable, but it is a pain to not have access to the rest of the lessons and possibly not being able to even get an assessment. Anyways, it has only been the w/e so far, so I’ll wait the week and see if anyone replies to my e-mail.