This might seem a question for the ITM forum, but I’m looking for a piping take on it, so I put it here.
Hopefully I’m explaining it in a way that makes sense.
Is it considered proper in ITM for a roll to cross beats within the same measure? I’m thinking in particular of “The Mist Covered Mountains.” The first measure in ABC notation goes, “eaa abD.” Since in 6/8 time the six notes are usually divided into two groups of three, if you play a long roll on the a, you get two a’s at the end of the first group and the third at the beginning of the second. This is very easy to do but it feels unnatural to me because it breaks up the three note group that the roll produces. I occasionally hear this done in other tunes, but either it’s pretty rare or I’m missing a lot of occurrences.
The only recording I have of this tune substitutes another a for the initial e, so you get a long roll followed by a cut, giving 4 a’s in succession rather than three. This works, but I like the sound of starting the tune with a jump of a fourth.
What I usually do is start on the e, then bounce the a finger to separate the first pair of a’s, followed by a cut for the third, essentially a backwards long roll. This makes more sense to me in terms of meter, but I’m not sure I like the sound of it.
Does anyone care to give an opinion about the propriety of a long roll on the a? How about another solution? Thanks.
I suggest an’ interupted roll’ which ,sort of ,crosses from one group to the next by going e-a-cut a, pat a-b-D which would be a fairly standard way to tackle that bar without disturbing the natural internal rhythm.
Actually, it’s “EAA ABd”. Reverse the upper/lower cases.
Of course, there’s nothing magical about bar lines or note groupings on the page. Yes, in general you want to maintain a well-defined duple meter for reels. But this is “violated” selectively all the time for the sake of phrasing and expression.
In this case, the note transition from E to A on the second eighth-note of the phrase implies a kind of syncopation to begin with, whether you play (conceptually) |E ~A2 ABd| or |E ~A3 Bd|. And to me, the syncopation signals that you have considerable flexibility for its continuation. Including just playing the long roll across the beat.
Geoff’s solution seems good, if he means his pat to be really a full (longer) closure of the second A. This gives, in effect: |EA{c}.A ABd|, which is technically no longer a roll.
I also like your reverse roll solution: |E A{G}A{c}A Bd|. This puts the cut on the second duple beat, which tends to emphasize the “normal” beat. It may sound strange at first, but it’s more common than you might think. And if you completely close/lengthen the {G} tap, you end up in effect with a hemiola |E.A A{c}A Bd|, which can also be interesting if used sparingly.
In general, to my ear there’s nothing wrong with extending a roll across the beat or half-beat - an opinion which can sometimes be flame bait. You see this reflected in transcriptions all the time. For example, The Shaskeen as |DG~G2 BG~G2| vs. |D~G3 B~G3|. Some people like to think of things “squared”, others like the syncopation. In the end, the two notations are moot, given the many ways you can time and execute either one.
I dont’ feel like playing a roll here. I should play the firs two A’s staccato and then put a cut to separate the third one.
In a jig, I just play long rolls when there is a dotted crochet on the beat.
I agree with Peter Likestone. Actually, I’ve been struggling quite a bit to get rid of the habit of playing an outright roll there (as it seemed rather obvious at first – three As, that’s crying out for a long roll, what else?). I think it tends to make the rhythm a bit fuzzy, as for my own playing at least. So I’d most certainly cut the 3rd A, and either pat or stop the 2nd. (I don’t play the pipes though.)
BTW, in his flute tutor Mr. Ó Gráda suggests to separate two same notes before the beat (as in EAA…) by a pat anyway. This way, the question doesn’t even arise in the first place. Really should have got this book earlier.
It’s been a couple of years since I’ve used ABC notation. I should have refreshed my memory.
I have a few new ideas of what to do with this bar now. So far my favorite is the staccato first A, but I’ve been playing with the hemiola as well. I’m not sure if I will use it much, but it’s good practice, for sure.
