I’ve received a request from a pipemaker as follows. I’ve removed names, only because I haven’t asked permission to include them.
Is there any place on Chiff & Fipple where a bagpipe business like … and others like myself who supply pipers with the tools of their avocation can advertise? Yes I have read your policy on commercial posts but it seems to me that all pipers are dependent on those of us who supply the products they take great pleasure in using. Why not have a separate page that lists these people with their contact information? You would be providing a valuable service to the piping community and I should think it would encourage participation in your chat rooms.
I wrote back and indicated I’d be more than happy to compile a list similar to the flute list
and he indicated that would be lovely. I’d actually include more contact details at the discretion of the maker/supplier.
I know of at least one other list on the web, but I gather there’s a need for this or the request wouldn’t have come.
I’m doing some thinking about how to proceed, but before I do, I just thought I’d throw this open for a general discussion and see what kind of reactions and ideas come up.
Na Piobairi Uilleann supplies a exhaustive Directory of Pipemakers on their website. That should sort everybody out without the need for advertising here.
Peter, the request is inclusive of the broader smallpipes community, not solely Uilleann pipes. The individual making the request, in addition to being an Uilleann and Scottish smallpipe maker, also provides reedmaking supplies and various styles of bellows which are of interest to smallpipers in general.
Dale, I think such a list would be beneficial, assuming the following:
It needs to be maintained. A list of broken or dead links does no one any good.
It needs to be accessible. Maybe a sticky in the Uilleann and Other Bagpipes forums? I would be willing to provide a link on The Pipers’ Gathering website. Might also be able to get a link on the Dunsire forums.
This looks at first glance to be someone wanting to sell pipemakers tools…and he indicated it would be lovely.Of course it would.. saves him advertising and it would be free no doubt.
I agree wi Peter there is no need for this.
As for Mark chipping in wi it being part of the broader smallpipe community, I for one do not consider the term smallpipe is applicable to Uilleann Pipes.If’n he wants to provide some interest for the smallpipe community fine put it on the non-uilleann pipe forum thats what it is there for surely We have enough trouble as it is wi oot inviting the world to join us.Where does it stop?
Uilliam
Well, the question was posted here and from the perspective of the Uilleann pipes I feel the ground has been covered pretty well. I much like the forums without people flogging their wares if you don’t mind.
It seems the need you refer to (for a place to advertise) is felt by the advertiser. Yeah right, I bet he feels the need.
I wouldn’t have a problem with one dedicated threat being set aside for pipemakers to advertise their wares. Maybe the commercial policy could be changed so that makers would post only to a specific thread, and be limited in the number of such postings in any one month.
The NPU list is generally very good for uilleann pipers, but in the past it has been slow to remove out of date information (old telephone numbers, retired pipemakers). I don’t know what it’s like these days.
Uilleann pipes as small pipes? I always thought the term small pipes was only used to differentiate between Great Highland Bagpipes and Scottish Small Pipes? How about a compromise - “expensive pipes”.
Speaking only for myself, I think that discussion boards like this are best suited for … discussion and dynamic content, and are an awkward medium for maintaining lists and other more static resources, commercial or otherwise, that are better hosted on regular websites (including, perhaps, the main C&F site). If the requester (or anyone) wants to compile, host, and properly maintain the list in question elsewhere, I’m sure it would get mentioned and pointed to here as appropriate, just as any other useful internet resource or list, knowledge of which is in common circulation here on the board. And the maintainer is free to classify smallpipes, bigpipes, inbetweenpipes, drainpipes, etc. as their own lights dictate.
I think features like sticky FAQs and “lists of lists” can work well on a board, but that’s a different and larger issue. There’s also some discussion underway now about segregating and presenting commercial content and activity here in a more systematic way, and that’s an open issue at the moment.
I concur with Peter & Uilleam
There has recently been a clearout of stickies so adding another would start the cicle of too many again
NPU list is fine and another facility exists over on the Uilleann Discussion forum under “PIpes for sale” for them to advertise and sell their wares although I find it strange that in these time where demand outstrips supply that a maker would need to tout for custom and if so why ?
John
…
Now then ye will find 2 lists here unfortunately the NPU one isn’t obtainable because the address has changed, but no one bothered to amend it here.
This is the correct address http://www.pipers.ie/makerlist.asp
So ye see we cannot keep oor own hoose in order but are quick aff the mark to dissy NPU
We already have two lists how many do ye need???
I say let the smallpipe makers go to their own wee forum and gi us peace.
Uilliam
We’ve also maintained a rather larg-ish list of makers, clubs, and reedmaking suppliers on the SLCP site for about five years now:
While not all-inclusive certainly, and obviously well duplicated several times over on larger site’s like Fr. Pat’s and NPU, it’s been a great resource to many looking for info concerning the above.
Is this maker asking us to post personal contact info on the open internet? No thanks. Been fighting off that spam for years.
It seems ironic (at the very least!) that people in the US are trying so VERY desperately to get their names OFF of businesses address books…where bills are passed and programs set up such as the various “do not call list”.
Frankly I would never want to be pandered to and advertised at by any pipemaker or craftsman of any sort. Frankly if their wares are good enough business will come to them. As it is I am CONSTANTLY being flooded with emails and correspondence originating from Pakistan…(did anyone ever notice that ALL the pakistani pipes all come from the town of Sialkot?! It’s true, do your own research)
Ultimately, a list such as this would only benefit the maker in question. I simply cannot see how it could benefit the pipers therein listed.
Seth Gallagher has a piper’s list, sorted by state and country. I am on it and have been for about 7 or 8 years and I have received communications from people on occaision. But those communications have all been from people seeking musicians to play at a wedding, with a group, or for some other event. It has not been like junk mail, spam or anything (so far). I have also received emails from new pipers reaching out to find help and to look for local advice.
I think the idea was to make a list of makers, not one of pipers. See the flutemakers list Dale linked to.
Dean Karres had a pipers list maybe ten years ago, that did cause a degree of spam and also requests to play the theme of Braveheart at weddings in Limerick or to appear on the Cliffs of Moher at sunset for a weddingceremony sometime mid october. Requests I could do without anyway. I wouldn’t go on anything like that again. Still getting Pakistani pipes spam that must have come from that listing.
Still getting Pakistani pipes spam that must have come from that listing
Not necessarily Peter, I get Pakistani pipe spam and I don’t know why.
Perhaps we should remove the word uilleann from our metatags and replace with . . . actually if you can get spammed from uilleann then presumably nothing is safe!
This may very well be true for established makers who are able to generate enough business by word of mouth and reputation within the piping community alone, without the need to advertise or even have a website, but for less established makers who want to get their name out there, advertising online or in piping publications can be a good way of doing this. If these up-and-coming makers sat there waiting for somebody to order a set from them, they would be there forever and a potentially talented maker might never have the chance to flourish.
Of course there is no substitute for showcasing one’s work at a meeting, but these are not always easy to attend because of distance and, for makers who aren’t yet full-time, work commitments. We need to give new pipe makers the best support to rise in their profession if their craft is to survive.
I think there’s a hint of ‘saville row’ snobbery in the idea that pipe makers should not advertise at all. Saville row tailors do not need to advertise because they have been established for such a long time, and have made suits for prime ministers and other famous personages. Likewise with the more established pipe makers (excepting the bit about prime ministers because i don’t think any PMs have ever played irish bagpipes).
Anyway, on the subject of the thread; there’s probably enough lists as it is.
No, I really don’t think so. There is too much pent-up demand for any quality set to sit idle.
As for “established makers” not advertising, it’s not snobbery. Very few makers need advertise, unless they are pltching a high price point and trying to maximize income, i.e. they are successfully throttling demand by some other means. The last thing most established makers need is more business! If folks are not lining up to buy your wares, perhaps more R&D is called for.
I think the biggest mistake most learning pipemakers make is selling stuff too early, too eagerly. Every pipemaker I have asked has given this advice; and though I thought I was taking it to heart, in hindsight I too made this error. Soon enough my order books were bulging, and in the beginning this is excess production pressure which is likely to do more harm than good. I think that even if I had been in a hut on some desert island[*], word would have gotten out once I produced something decent.
As for travelling to events, etc., I really wonder about any aspiring pipemaker who does not travel to piping events, at least regionally; it doesn’t make sense. While pipemaking can be an isolated pastime, you’ve got to do a bit of mixing with other pipers in order to get sufficient feedback on your work.
regards
Bill
[*] instead of in a coal shed on a North Atlantic island…[/size]
and for those who are unfortunate enough not receive emails fromt he East
Where they get names from - forums, groups, lists - all it takes is one email address and they have you - just add em to the spam filter
Dear Sir/Madam,
We “Platinium Royal Tunes” are the Manufacturers & Exporter of Excellent quality of Music Instruments in very Competitive prices and in time delivery Since last 25 Years and get positive response.
We deal with the following music instruments range.
To see our products range, Pls. visit our web site www.royaltunes.biz and let us know your demand to proceed further.
We shall be much pleased to work and include our name in your suppliers’ list. Once again, it is confirmed that our quality must be fine and nice. You may demand samples from us to check quality and prices.
Thanks for your valued time and awaiting your positive comments.
Best regards,
Abdul Rehman
Manager Sales
Platinium Royal Tunes
Muslim Street Mubarik pura,
51310 sialkot Pakistan.
Tell No. : +92-52-3552012
Fax No. : +92-52-3550466 sales@royaltunes.biz www.royaltunes.biz
We have enough trouble as it is wi oot inviting the world to join us.Where does it stop?
