I find I very easily overblow the low E-note into the 2nd octave on my Copeland Low D. It seems like the D and F# can reach a higher volume before jumping up to 2nd.
Could this simply be because of the E hole is so small compared to D and F#?
Almost seems like the E hole is made small to make the stretch less bothersome, but this is no problem for me at all. Would it be possible to have Michael “open up” the E to match the other notes?
Thanks in advance whistlers!
/Peter
On 2002-06-25 19:30, Pan wrote:
I find I very easily overblow the low E-note into the 2nd octave on my Copeland Low D. It seems like the D and F# can reach a higher volume before jumping up to 2nd.Could this simply be because of the E hole is so small compared to D and F#?
No. It’s your imagination and/or your breath control (probably…) In any case, the only hole that can affect the E is the bottom-most hole, which I think you are calling the D hole… closed holes are closed, and have no affect on the sound, so for D the only ‘hole’ with any affect is the end of the tube, for the E, it’s the bottom hole and the end of the tube, and so on…
(Of course, if by the E hole you mean the hole that you uncover to play the E, that is, the bottom-most fingerhole… it might constrict the airflow a little, I don’t know for sure)
Almost seems like the E hole is made small to make the stretch less bothersome, but this is no problem for me at all. Would it be possible to have Michael “open up” the E to match the other notes?
Eek-no! Wider holes change the pitch of all the notes above… it’s smaller because it’s higher up the tube… (given an arbitrary point on the tube, an arbitrary hole can be made higher in pitch either by moving it up the tube or widening the hole) once a whistle has been tuned, the only way to widen a hole without changing the tuning would be to move the hole down the whistle, so that the note flattens by downward movement at the same time that it sharpens by widening. (This wouldn’t even actually do it because of differences in upper/lower octave effects of hole placement and size, and effects on notes above the hole being ‘adjusted’ …)
Maybe someone else knows different, but, I think it’s just that D and E are always the easiest notes to overblow…
–Chris
I have to say that I love my Copelands but I formerly owned a Copeland Low D which had exactly the problem described here. That low E note was too easy to overblow. I was so sure it was a problem that I sent it to Bob Pegritz, who couldn’t figure out what the heck I was talking about. He then took it to Mike Copeland, who couldn’t figure out what the heck I was talking about. I’ve not encountered the problem on any other Low D I’ve played, including about two other Copelands (Low Ds) I’ve played.
It’s by no means a Copeland (I wish it was!!!), but for what it’s worth, the Susato low D I play has the exact same behavior: the low D and low F-sharp will both take far more air than the low E will, which easily flips up to the 2nd octave.
On flute this note will take air and have good volume, but on every Irish flute I’ve played it has a slightly different timbre, more hollow somehow, than the notes around it. On the flute this is also true in the 2nd octave to a lesser degree.
Best wishes,
–James
http://www.flutesite.com
I had the same problem on a Burke low D Al Pro. (Please forgive me, Mike.) Mike said that low E’s are hard to make sound good and loud, like the surrounding notes. But who wants to crack up an octave, and who wants to worry about cracking while playing? I ended up sending it back. Mike was very understanding. Whistle makers do want to know what’s wrong with their whistles, so that they can fix the problem.
JP
Thanks!
Dale,
strange you had it on one Low the but not the others??? Makes my theory about the size of the E hole a little “thin”.
However I am very curious how the whistle would play with a E hole equal in size as the F#. The only note it could affect is the F#, but I dont think it would be a problem.
Of course if the hole was opened up (centered as now) the intonation would suffer. However if the whistle was made with a bigger E hole from the beginning.. I wonder.
I played diferent notes (around G) and the only note that was affected by the E hole covered or not was the F#, and that was only about 5% or so which could easily be compensated for (if at all noticed as there are already intonation “errors” greater than 10% between other notes on this whistle) with “breath control”.
Maybe it would be possible to enlarge the hole in the direction towards the “D” end of the bore (which I meant in the first place) so the edge closest to the head of the whistle remains at the same distance.
There is no question though about that the E is weaker than D and F# and also flip up to 2nd with less air.
I will have to ask Michael about this issue.
Later…
/Peter
I believe the reason the hole is smaller is so it can be higher on the instrument to make the reach humanly possible.
If you enlarged the hole you would probably need some sort of key mechanism to reach it. It’s actually been done; there are tenor and bass recorders with keys for just that purpose.
–James
http://www.flutesite.com
James,
thats what I´ve been thinking as well.
However I can easily cover a bigger hole placed lower on the bore so for me maybe
a “resizing” of the E could be something.
I think I could play a Low C without much problem.
/Peter
Hi Peter,
Good meeting up with you in England!
There are more than a few reasons for the hole size and placement. Yes, a larger tone hole placed lower could still play the same tone, but, it’s not that easy. The difference in scale, half step vs. a full step (lower hand vs. the upper hand) creates some problems.
The two largest tone holes on the whistle are the bell note, the bottom of the bore, and that 2nd from the bottom or F# tone hole. As for the bottom, E tone hole, the pressure differential require to jump to the 2nd octave is always touchy.
It’s really a question of voicing rather than tuning. If one favors the lower octave to be stronger, the E is more stable, but this is at the expense of having the upper octave play needing much more breath volumne and pressure as well. We try to balance the Low D having a strong low end with the second octave playing much more freely.
Some players don’t mind the extra effort required on the high end, Michael and myself included.
Please call us at the shop, if it’s not too costly from Sweden, and we can discuss options if you like. Otherwise, we can just use e-mail.
Jim