I read about this on Xinhua.net, the Chinese Press agency. I was thinking of Simon’s contention of how illegitimate the current Iraqi government is, and looking to see what the official Chinese take was on it. At least in their news coverage, it seems like they consider it a legitimate government. "Puppets’ or “lackeys” wasn’t used once.
For those who wish to have a handy single page to check out world opinion/news coverage, the lower left hand corner of www.drudgereport.com has many press agencies. Unfortunately, the Islamic one isn’t in English,while most others offer English versions.
Weeks, is it me or are the crickets chirping especially loudly on this thread?
Ah, who knows. I thought about addressing the issue of whether the government in Iraq is legitimate or not but it’s so much in the eye of the beholder.
I mean, after 45 years or so of a murderous dictator, what kind of government is going to be created there that passes Simon’s test?
I guess the only one would be from a revolution from within the country. Sometimes, I try and weigh the following: those who were tortured by Saddam (with or without U.S. or other Western nations assistance) and would be in the future by his two darling proteges vs. the idea that Iraq didn’t DESERVE to be liberated because they couldn’t pull it off themself.
This IS a separate issue from Bush’ pretexts for going there but now that its done and Saddam is in skivvies, it seems like the battle now is to please those outside the country that something legitimate is coalescing.
As I pointed out, the list of those who refuse to accept the new Iraq’s flag include at least Simon. Not sure about Gilder. But other countries seem willing to accept Iraq’s diplomatic credentials, but then, maybe George W. has a missile pointed at their bedroom or something.
Only if they had an internal revolution would many in this world consider them a legitimate government instead of Bush-tainted… And maybe the process of winning it would have resulted in less insurgents etc. But it certainly MIGHT have drawn either south of the border Shiites, Iranian Shiites, Kurds, etc into the country to fight for control, especially with the oil wealth at stake.
I guess South Korea is a puppet government too, as was West Germany and the new Japan; as all had US occupation and/or invasion at least for some of the time of their creation.
I would like to mention that it would have been easier for the people to revolt in the first place if it wasn’t for outsiders bringing in money that only strengthened the dictatorship. I think that the days of countries being independent in this way is long over.
Also if that argument is valid then the preexisting government (President Hussein’s) couldn’t be considered legitimate, could it.
I do not think that most people think that the removal of President Hussein is what most people have an issue with. I think that some see it as a bad precedent that the president (by some people’s view) manipulated the government do something and that as long as some good came out of it that we should forgive him.
PS I realize that you were just speculating what someone else would think.
Hi IRTradRU?
Would you not think that this is just old fashioned realpolitik in action. The panel is going to go ahead whether there were Sunnis on it or not, so it is a matter of some influence versus none at all.
David
As I pointed out, the list of those who refuse to accept the new Iraq’s flag include at least Simon. Not sure about Gilder. But other countries seem willing to accept Iraq’s diplomatic credentials, but then, maybe George W. has a missile pointed at their bedroom or something.
It’s not that I refuse to accept the government, but that you can’t with honesty accuse any Iraqis of treason for refucing to accept the government installed by an occupying power, who “rule” without real authority according to a constitution written by that occupying power and were chosen in a process designed and supervised by that power.
One cannot break a social contract which you never assented to. The Sunnis did not recognise either the Bremer constitution or the election; and so did not participate in it, and play not role in the new government. It is only through the US’s force of arms, then, that the authority of that government is asserted over them.
Resistance to occupation isn’t rebellion.
Tell me; what significant authority does the new government exercise? Have they done anything to defy the wishes of the US ambassador?
An autonomous government has the ability to seek it’s own policies, independent of it’s allies.
~~
And as for Japan, for the entire period in which General MacArthur was in Tokyo calling the shots, no, the japanese government could not be called autonomous.
It’s a huge improvement over the former, though.
“Old fashioned”? No, I don’t think so. We’re witnessing the birth of democracy here, and I see it as vital and incredibly important.
“When Sunnis get blue
Their eyes get dark and angry
Suicidal bombers call
Pitter patter shrapnel spatter
buildings fall and windows shatter
Over there when Sunnis get blue”
(With apologies to Jack Segal & Marvin Fisher)