On this forum people have reported about their problems to get heared when playing in sessions. Well, I have no problem at all now that I mainly play in the 3rd and fourth octave. Now this is where the whistle really starts to kick in! With the normal instrument setup I don’t usually need any amplification at all. Actually I found the sound of most of my whistles, even Susatos, to be somewhat wavery and weak in the second and especially in the first octave.
Whenever I play in sessions people come to ask about my technique and they tell that my playing really stands out from the other players. A funny thing was when I was practising some reels and airs during lunch hour at a park nearby, some construction workers came complimenting me and asked the usual questions “what is that instrument?” and told me that they could hear the beautiful sounds of music even through their hearing protecters and 200 meters away inside a building!
I measured the frequencies - D and E in third octave are damn high frequencies, and looking at graph of frequency development, fourth octave would be totally ultrasonic
Considering how ear-piercing is just the lowest part of third octave, higher notes and fourth octave would be totally horrible (and ultrasonic, i.e. unhearable).
Third octave on most whistles is screechingly awful enough (the top end of it anyway for those who can reach it) without even contemplating a fourth octave!!
I can’t say I’ve ever read about anyone hitting the fourth octave! I have to agree with MTguru about the lethalness of it after having heard the third on a D.
In my Susato VSB in D (one of my quieter Susatos) the note D of the 3rd octave is rather uncomfortable to my ears. I don’t think someone could play everything in the 3rd and 4th octave (unless you’re deaf!)
Also, as someone said, the 3rd and 4th octave doesn’t sound good and can be sharp.
The owner of my local woodwind shop is an incredible flautist, so his breath
control is top-notch. When he plays tinwhistle, it is exclusively in the 2nd and
3rd octave. It’s extremely musical, in tune and amazing (though piercing).
But I refuse to believe there is such a thing as “playing” in the 4th octave.
I think you may have to make a recording of that, if human technology can
pick it up…
Of all the whistles that I’ve had the opportunity to have tried so far, and that is a bunch, perhaps two have been able to be taken into the lower reaches of the third octave comfortably, without permanent hearing damage, and little or no residual scarring from the sharp objects hurled at me from the corner of the room that my youngest inhabits.
I make absolutely no claims to expert-ness, nor do I know it all, but good gravy, Heikki, what sort of whistles and players are you talking about??? this jes ain’t happenin’ in our usual experience.
I know, that it is impossible to play in the fourth octave - even in Finland, but meybe Heikki means, that he plays for example from c3 to b4 :-). Maybe he is a pianoplayer too, so that would explane his octaves.
If he is playing in the 4th octave, this would explain the reports of rats and pigeons suddenly fleeing the city. And the fact that his audiologist has been put on retainer.
Really! When I experiment for any length of time with 3rd octave fingerings, as jemtheflute and I were doing a few weeks ago, I have to wear ear protection, -30 dB earplugs. Otherwise it’s painful, and possibly dangerous.
I like this part:
Holy smoke, I should think so. Because at that point the other players are either dead or writhing on the floor in agony.
But he says he can also play in the 1st and 2nd octaves. If that means from A0 to A2, then that is a VERY BIG contrabass whistle he’s playing. Or maybe your clean Suomi air really does have magical properties!
As many of you already found out, this was just a joke! In real world I can play a couple of notes on the third octave, but I mainly play those notes on my A and Bb whistles only. With higher whistles the higher notes do tend to be a bit too shrill for my taste.
My car radio is broken and so I have time to entertain myself with silly ideas every day. Yesterday morning I got the idea about 3rd and 4th octave and I hope that you can forgive me sharing the idea with you…
I think it was quite obviously a joke when you think about “beautiful (???!!!) sounds of music heard even through their hearing protecters and 200 meters away inside a building”! If it was true, think about the volume level near the whistler; it would be something to make your ears (and probably your eyes and nose, too) bleed. Think about that kind of supersonic weapon in a session! Maybe in USA where handguns are are considered a civil right you could get away with going with that kind of weapon in public (if it existed), but here in Finland it would be forbidden.
I know this started out as a bit of fun but I have a serious question. Can anyone who understands whistles a bit better explain why my cheap Feadog (which has had a few tweaks) is the only whistle that I can play all three D 's easily with hardly any adjustments in air or fingering ?
Played with all holes closed - no venting.
Tom
Other then the above being actually true… You may have to find different fingering for 3rd octave D. Sometimes oxxooo will work, sometimes the standard middle D vented fingering will work. As a rule, High D almost rarely gets used in ITM, and most likely you’re not going to be holding it for any serious amounts of time… But there you go anyway, I’m sure others will pick up where I left out. Although personally I usually use oxx xxx for High D.
Feadog has a tapered windway, and that causes the air to cross over the window more efficiently. I do not know if Feadog makes a tapered windway on purpose or if that is just the way there mold happens to be set up. It is a small taper from the roof to the floor at the end of the windway. All the other whistles I have measured their windways have a stright through same size inlet and exit. I think the taper helps give a more pure tone, and straight through has what is known as a traditional tone.
I have read where some tweekers have heated Generation fipple windways close to the exit and mashed them closed slightly. I have not tried this myself. But I have opened the inlet end of a Generation Bb to produce a tapered windway. After these things are done it is more easy to just buy a Feadog.
I have tweaked a lot of Generation whistles, and sometimes find one with the windway a little closed on the end from the factory.
Different whistles are more capable of reaching the third octave. Really, though, I find it’s best to avoid the third octave as much as possible. People have enough problems with a whistle in the second octave; once you hit that third octave, even briefly, they really tend to hate you. I avoid any tunes that use the third octave, except maybe a quick third C, or change them up a little so I don’t have to.
