Here is my latest comparison recording:
http://www.flutesite.com/samples/3compare.mp3
This is the reel The Dairy Maid played on the following flutes:
M&E Rudall & Rose model
Seery Pratten model
Hamilton blackwood
I hope you enjoy it. It’s a fun reel to just relax on.
–James
www.flutesite.com
Well played! Thanks. I liked the blackwood
flute best–surprise, surprise!
I always enjoy these comparisons. (Amazing how good the M & E sounds!)
Dana
Thank you James, the various comparisons you have done have made it much easier for an inexperianced player like me to compare apples to apples and oranges to oranges.It was some of your earlier comparisons that helped me to decide on my new M&E R&R.It’s interesting to me to note that on this comparison that my ears can detect no differance between the M&E and the Hamilton . Jim says he prefers the Hamilton. Now I am beginning to realize how much variation there is in individual hearing abilities . The individual preferances for one make or another may simply stem from differances in hearing ability or temperment.After comparing recordings of various makers I have found that I like some flutes for a specific melody more than an outright preferance for Flute Brand X or Z.You are providing a valuable tool and service, thanks.
Bruce
I think blackwood sounds alive.
But I’m half deaf. In fact
the last years of my teaching
Iused a 'hearing ear’dog.
When the students said something
I’d ask the dog what they said:
WOOF! the dog responded.
Oh well, I thought, at least they’re
enthusiastic.
The dog also likes
the blackwood flute.
Not to be the old curmugeon that I am, but I find these recorded comparisons almost completely useless. Anyone who has ever sat beside a player and listened to him/her live, as opposed to on record, however cleanly recorded, can attest to the difference between the sound of a live flute versus a recorded one. Even the best recording devices eliminate certain highs and lows and overall presence to the flute(s) that are present in the hearing spectrum, and all recording devices to some degree compress the waves into a more uniform wave, even if the recording was done flat and basic, for authenticity’s sake.
So, in the end, it is harder to tell one flute from another recorded. The level-playing field that seems so obvious by using the same player, same song, same mic setup doesn’t actually work beyond the most extreme differences in intonation and tone.
What you’ve proven by all these samples, James, is that, played and recorded by the same person with the same style, all three of these flutes can be made less distinguishable from one another. What’s not demonstrated is which flute really sounds better.
I’m glad you like all your flutes, for all different reasons – that’s a verbal endorsement that says something and should be taken seriously. There are things to like in all these flutes, and you have the playing experience to voice them.
But I really think these recording coke-vs.-pepsi challenges do little to help the beginner, as they are more misleading than clarifying.
Curmugeonly yours,
Gordon
Well, I’ve a couple of thoughts.
First, Gordon, I appreciate your honest posting, but I must disagree with you.
I think that a flute-to-flute comparison is the only honest way to give someone who doesn’t have a flute a good idea of what it can do. Misleading? Hardly–I’ll agree the fidelity isn’t as good as if you were in the room with me, but these recordings are hardly so bad you can’t hear the difference in the flutes. I don’t have the best ear in the world, but I can hear it, quite clearly.
Up until the comparisons that I and others have done, all a beginner had to go on was word of mouth, especially–and I can’t emphasize this enough–if you live, as I do, where the closest experienced Irish flute player is over a hundred miles away in any direction.
I think perhaps what surprises you is how good a polymer flute can sound. They sound far better still if you are in the room with me. There is a reason I keep these flutes now that I have the Hammy–they are fine flutes. And I think that’s the concept you may have the most issue with: I play a Hammy, and I still say the polymers are fine flutes in their own right, very capable instruments indeed.
Perhaps you haven’t found them to be so. Different people have different experiences with different flutes, and that’s a very fundamental truth that is also hard for a beginner to understand, which is why word of mouth can be so misleading.
But at the end of the day, no matter what flute I play I tend to sound like me. My playing is recognizable rather I play a blackwood Hamilton or a plastic M&E–and that is perhaps the most important point I can make with these recordings. It is the flutist, not the flute, that at the end of the day defines the sound.
Respectfully,
–James
On re-reading both Gordon’s post and I my own, I find that we make many of the same points, and I actually find little to disagree with in his posting, except for the assertion that the comparison recordings are of little value.
–James
James - I agree with you on the value of these recordings. Granted, the player does make the biggest difference, it would sound best live, but I can tell differences that are attributable to the instruments. Locally, the only instruments I’d have a chance to hear live are 2 Dave Williams flutes (one keyed, one unkeyed - both owned by the same player) and an antique German flute.
Now, if I could ever find the time to make the 5 hour drive across Missouri to St. Louis, I could hear more instruments. But my car is old, the AC isn’t working right anymore, and I don’t have the leave time to easily take off from work…
Eric
It’s always a question of opinion, of course, and this is an open forum. Blah blah blah, disclaim disclaim disclaim.
I think any of these sound bytes of flute, particularly the flute, have to be taken with a huge grain of salt. Work with me on this one.
Anyone have a whole slew of recordings by one person, like, say, Molloy? I’ve got his old Eb black album, new stuff, him with the Chieftains, him with other people. For the sake of argument, let’s say he’s playing only 3 instruments: an Eb, a D, and a Bb. He sounds like Matt Molloy on all three. I could pick out Molloy from . . . say, hmm, Crawford 10/10 times. For various reasons, of course, but one of them has to be the player’s embouchure.
Flute is inherently QUITE player-variable in tone. The cut of the embouchure hole is perhaps the #1 variable with the instrument, but that’s lightyears behind the player himself or herself. I’ve owned and played instruments by everyone from Burns to Wilkes and I don’t sound all that different on any of them. Some of them suit me a lot more, and I really like(d) playing some of them better than others, but I sounded like me.
Once I was selling a flute, a Cotter, to someone who knew Turlach Boylan. So, Turlach and I met up at a local pub, and Turlach played my Cotter. He sounded just like Turlach, not like me. Quite different.
So . . . what am I saying. I think it’s fun to listen to these MP3s of other people comparing various flutes, but I think all it REALLY does is tell us which instruments suit that particular person. Not to detract anything from what James has done, but I don’t think the comparison helps a potential buyer at all, and in fact, might be misleading if the buyer thinks the flute is the key to how you sound. I don’t think that’s true at all, so I don’t find them misleading. Not that there’s an intent to mislead, either.
There’s a lot more to be said for side-by-side whistle comparisons, even though the way you hold your mouth and the whistle can affect the sound to some small degree. There’s a ton to be said for side-by-side comparison of the pipes, GHB or uilleann or whatever, since there is zero contribution of embouchure to the sound produced.
I guess I’m just weighing in on one side of this discussion-cum-argument. 
I just feel like the relationship between flautist and flute is so much closer than nearly anything else, that really the only way to have any real idea at all how instruments will sound for you is to play them yourself.
I know that’s impractical for many of the people getting into flute playing. But seriously, how much can we know from these comparisons, vis-à-vis buying a flute? I think Skip Healy’s embouchure cut is really hard for beginners; I started out on a Metzler-conical design by Terry McGee with a really easy (to me) embouchure. Some folks play Skip’s flutes and really love the feel of that embouchure. Maybe I’d like it now that I’ve got more experience; who knows.
I’d just hate for a beginner to hear me play three flutes and say, “Gosh, I want an Olwell Pratten because Stuart sounds best on an Olwell Pratten and I don’t like how he sounds on the Byrne.” Yikes! Maybe the beginner would be better off with a Byrne! Who knows?!?
I’ll quit the ramble.
Stuart
Stuart,
you’ve made some exceptionally good points. However, I think anything is better than nothing, and for many folks with NO access to wooden/Irish flutes in their areas, well, I think these comparisons give you something at least to judge by. It would be even better if more folks did these, so you could hear the same flute played by different folks which would allow an even better comparison.
Maybe Houston is different than KC, but I’ve been scouring the flea markets, antique stores and auctions for over 20 years now. I collect swords but have been keeping an eye out for wooden flutes since I started playing whistle which was 10 years ago, and I can tell you I’ve found exactly 0 wooden flutes in those years while I’ve seen a goodly 80-90 swords. I’ve seen tons of Boehm flutes. The most “Irish” of flutes sold by any local music store is the good old Hall Crystal Flute. As I said earlier, the only flutes in my local sessions are the two Dave Williams and an antique German flute.
How should I go about finding a flute?
My method has been to ask players on the web who seem knowledgable about what flutes they like, but that is entirely subjective. I also listen to any flute MP3s I can by anyone who puts one on the net so I can listen to how certain flutes sound in the hands of different players - but again this is, as you point out, related to the player as much as anything.
So I return to my original point. Unless you are blessed and live in a land surrounded by wooden flutes, you grasp at any straw you can to help you make the best decision possible (and you also buy only from makers with full return policies…).
Just my 2 cents worth here…
Eric
Stuart,
I don’t think we are on different sides.
Flutes are indeed an instrument where the player is part of the sound, more than any other wind instrument. A flute that works for one player may not work well for another at all.
But that’s the value of a comparison…it does show you what one player can get out of whichever flutes are in question.
However…
My intention in providing the comparisons is not to steer beginning flutists toward one instrument or away from another. I do not recommend anyone chose a flute based only on my recordings. What I do recommend is to ask several different players that you respect their opinions on the flutes you are considering, contact the makers, and listen to every recording you can get your hands on, amateur and pro, on those flutes.
Why the comparison recordings? Really, just for fun. I enjoy doing them, and I find it fascinating myself to hear the subtle differences in a tune that going from flute to flute can make.
I have been contacted by many many people who have found my recordings to be of some value to them, and it always makes my day to get an email or phone call about them. As long as I keep getting such positive comments, I will likely keep doing the comparisons.
And as I’ve said before and will likely say again, it is the flutist far more than the flute that defines the sound. I still sound pretty much like myself, even when playing Irish music on the silver flute. There aren’t any “magic flutes” that will just play themselves. The real magic is in the skill and soul of the player.
–James
Yes, well, there’s the rub, isn’t it!
It’s a hard question. Houston may only be different from KC in that there are a few good flute players with some interesting instruments. That doesn’t mean that everything is so accessible, though. Eh!
I guess, well, what do I guess. I just caution that the recordings are, in fact, NOT better than no sound bytes. I’ll take Eric’s example.
Let’s say, Eric, for the sake of argument that you’re a beginner looking for his first flute. What can you do . . . short of spending a TON of money travelling around to play an example of each maker’s work?
I suppose what I’d do, coming from the experience I have, is do a lot of research. Most of it will be on the internet. I was lucky, in that when I started, people like Terry McGee had flutes in stock, ready for shipment. I had read nice things about Terry’s work, and since he had a boxwood Metzler conical in stock, that’s what I went with. I loved that flute, and only sold it when I decided I wanted to go with a more powerful flute. Metzlers are quite nice, but a little on the thin side for my taste.
Now, what would have happened if I’d heard recordings of the Metzler head-to-head with a typical Rudall and a typical Pratten? I probably would have bought a Pratten, and would have been quite frustrated with how difficult it was to play. As it was, I developed a little bit of a relationship with Terry, who helped me get to the conclusion that I wanted the Metzler.
This is another major ramble, I realize that.
I suppose I can see the value in recordings for ONE thing, and that might be this: if you found someone else at about your same level of training, a recording comparing a few flutes might just tell you something interesting. I think it’s a lot easier for a rank-and-file beginner to fill a smaller-bore instrument than a big one. So, if you heard this player play a few Prattens and a Rudall, I bet you’d like the Rudall. Or a few Rudalls and a Noë Frères (small-hole French flute), you’d probably want the Noë.
So, well. I suppose what I’d say to people who are buying a first flute is that the choice isn’t all that hard, because I think we tend to fixate on the wrong things. How James sounds on a Seery, a Hamilton, and an M&E has little bearing on how I’d like to play any of them. Imagine my frustration if I bought the Hamilton because I liked the way it sounded the best, and I couldn’t play it, or it was out of tune with my lips?
If at all possible, I think getting an instrument from a maker who’s geographically close is really important for timber instruments. Probably matters considerably less for polymers. So, proximity is important. Believe me, if you want anything changed, it takes a lot of time and a lot of money to send flutes back-and-forth from the US to Ireland or Australia. Second, parallel with the first, is the maker’s reputation. There are a lot of excellent makers out there, and it’s probably not hard to develop quite a list just looking through the Chiffboard archives.
Style of flute . . . that’s a toughie, and even though I have my opinions, how could you EVER know without playing them for yourself? I think beginners are better served with narrower-bore instruments with oval embouchures. That’s what I think.
Material. Yikes. ANY time this comes up, here come the opinions and the edicts and the dogma. I like timber. It costs more and requires more care than polymer, but that’s all there is to it. If I’d started all this in high school, and had a limited budget, I’d probably have steered towards polymer or an alternative hardwood (like mopane, or Cooktown ironwood). Now I like cocus. Another hard question.
So, the comparisons are fun, but really, for flutes, I think they muddy things up and aren’t helpful for the purpose of making a decision as to which flute to buy. If your idol plays an Olwell, you’ll probably want to get on the Olwell list, regardless of how someone else sounds on Olwells.
Speaking of which, I have a friend who has a nice Wilkes and a nice Olwell. Last time I heard the side-by-side comparison, I really liked how the Olwell sounded, and not so much the Wilkes. I’ve heard other people that sound astounding on Wilkes instruments. I played my friend’s Olwell, and ordered myself an Olwell, and haven’t looked back. Eh!
I don’t know why these posts make me want to keep posting. I just feel kind of strongly about it, I suppose!
Stuart
I do find these comparison posts interesting and
valuable, just in getting a sense of how flutes
sound in relation one to another. I doubt
that I would base a decision about
which flute to buy on one of these,
of course, but James isn’t making
grand claims for the utility of this,
of course. Indeed, they are especially
revealing to people who already
know what flutes sound like.
The Hamilton sounds like a
blackwood flute, the Seery sounds
like my Seery, and the MandE, which
I’ve never heard, sounds quite strong,
which is useful to me.
One thing I notice and that Gordon’s post seems
to second: I have never heard an instrument
harder to record than an Irish flute.
I never liked the sound of Irish flutes,
which I heard for a long while only
on CDs. Then one day I heard somebody
play one live, not a great player but not
a bad one either, and was amazed by
the beauty of the sound. This strikes me as an extraordinarily
alive and lovely instrument in person,
which tends to sound rather dull recorded.
Anybody else have this impression?
Stuart,
your description of what to do when a newbie first wants a flute matches pretty much what I did, and I ended up with a Dixon 3 piece. I still like the flute, it’s a smaller bore flute, and it’s been great to learn on (and it’s fun for baroque pieces since you can cross-finger sharps/flats so very well). Money was also an issue for me, as was flute material - polymer better suits both my lifestyle and climate.
However, I did listen to clips of the Dixon done by a few different players over on Clips and Snips before I went with the Dixon and that helped me. I could hear how the flute might sound. I knew it would sound different when I played it, but it also helped me know the flute could sound “good” which was a major concern since it was only $200.
I’m currently waiting for a Seery (like I said, I’m a polymer fan). I play around making bamboo flutes, and I like the larger bored ones I’ve made with whomping big holes to allow easy half-holing of notes. So, I’ve decided I want to try a Prattenesque flute or a large holed R&R model. I’ve also spent time listening to different clips of the Seery (lamentably too few for my tastes) as well as listening to the Seery on CDs. I know I’ll sound different on it, but I like what I’ve heard others can do with it. James’ clips of the Seery and the M&E R&R, as well as advice from trusted board members, helped me pick the Seery over the M&E R&R model. In actuality, probably either flute would do, and asthetics did slip into my decision.
I guess where I’m going is I do find sound samples to be useful for me when considering a flute. However, I give as much, if not more weight, to the opinions of players I trust. I find it hard to think that any additional information is bad or useless information.
I do agree newbies, or anyone else really, shouldn’t base their opinion only on sound clips.
Oh and Jim - I agree that Irish flutes always sounds much better in person. Recordings seem to steal some of the vitality and uniqueness of their sound…
Eric - who like Stuart appears to feel passionate about this issue! 
We are all passionate about issues involving wooden flutes! Of course we are, that’s why we are here.
I don’t really think this is a “take sides” or “right or wrong” issue. And I definitely have never meant for any of my recordings to generate controversy.
I am thrilled that there are people who feel my recordings have been of use to them (for whatever reason).
And I hope, at least where C&F members’ recordings are concerned, we can keep things on a light and fun level. If people are to be held to studio-quality recordings and virtuoso levels of performance skill, I would imagine that soon no one will post recordings at all.
And I think that would be a shame.
–James
Agree with this. Thanks for the clips. It’s good fun
and not serious business.
Alan Ginsburg once kicked me in
the stomach. We were about to
take a Bodhisatva Vow at a buddhist
center–vowing to be reborn until
all sentient beings are enlightened.
I was ranting that I didn’t want to come
back upteem million times as a frog
so I could save Richard Nixon, etc.
etc. Ginsburg, who was sitting next to me,
raised his stockinged foot, very gently kicked
me in the stomach, and said:
‘What are you making a Federal Case
out of it for? It’s just a Bodhisatva Vow.’
It’s rather interesting–guitars, e.g. classical, often
sound ravishing on CDs. Hammered Dulcimers too.
I suppose many instruments sound less good
recorded–but Irish flutes are especially tough.
I’m listening to recordings by Chris Norman,
which seem to me especially good in capturing
the flute.
Also it seems to me that maybe one has
to learn how to hear an Irish flute, if that
makes any sense. Well, I guess it does–when
you learn how an instrument is played,
it’s easier to appreciate what you hear.
Glad I could ignite this thread, in my usual way.. 
To add a bit to what I think Stuart was on about:
As a player, James, you’ve gone quite a way on those polymers; that is to say, you’ve grown as a player playing them and they suit you at this point. I don’t think I’m as amazed as you might believe I am that the polymers sound good – they don’t sound bad, but it’s hard to tell what they’d sound like if I or someone else played them (well, I have an idea, as I’ve played ones like them and heard others as well). All I’m hearing is you playing a few flutes you are quite comfortable with, and the Hamilton you’ve only recently aquired and practice shared time with on the polymers.
Here’s my own personal parable, so that I might be clearer.
I spent my first several – and frankly, most lucrative – years playing Irish music on a decent German flute I’m sure most of you are tired of hearing me describe. Let’s leave it that it has the usual German flute tuning idiosyncrosies and tone. As I became better as a player, I also made this flute sound pretty good. Most performances were through a PA system, and so I really could hear myself against the pipes and accordians,etc.
Thing is, when I first started playing the Hamilton, also through the PA, same tunes, same band – the Hamilton, which by itself is a far better, louder, purer and stronger toned instrument, I still sounded at first – to the rest of my band and others – not to unlike I was still playing the old instrument. Fact was, it took me quite awhile to grow playing the Hamilton; after awhile, the German left unplayed for months at first, the Hammy actually changed the way I approached tunes, changed my style a bit, allowed me to do new and different things the German was not capable of.
Now and then I pick up the old flute and play it. I don’t find it as comfortable as I had (understatement here), and I really notice it’s weaknesses more than I ever did, because originally I was a beginner and then I was accustomed to playing this flute and this flute alone. More importantly, I no longer made it sound as good as I used to, and if I recorded myself on it now, against the Hamilton, it would not sound as good as it had during the original transition when the German held its own and the Hammy sounded not too unlike it. In other words, the flutes didn’t change; I did.
Now, you keep playing those polymers and you sound good on them, and you sound good on the Hamilton, but not much different. I doubt you’ll do this, but I’d bet if you played only the Hamilton for 6 months or so, without touching the others, you’d hear and feel the difference returning to them, and the sound you would record then on all three would show the difference(s) between the flutes much more obviously. I also think you’d be less gung-ho about the polymers, but that’s another argument for another thread. You do sound fine on them, and ultimately, that’s all that should matter.
Beginners looking for flutes by listening to these comparisons also miss the feel of the flutes, how the sound feels in the room, or the flute in their hands. I understand the argument that these comparisons are better than nothing, but in many ways, they’re not.
James, I think your comparisons are cool – I’m not saying you shouldn’t do them, or that they’re not fun to listen to. I just think that beginners should focus on learning to play music well on almost any decent flute – the better polymers included, if that’s what they want to go for – and not worry about the comparisons as a means of proving something. Once you can play well, then what Stuart had to say is the most honest – you will only know what sounds/feels good when you play it, and that is not going to be the same thing from one to another, regardless of how it might stack up on a computer-recorded comparison test.
Gordon
Well, I do understand your position, but I don’t agree–your circumstance doesn’t parallel mine all that closely.
Although relatively new to Irish music, I have been playing many kinds of flutes for 26 years, and I’m not a big fan of the “stick to one instrument” approach, and never have been. I feel I have grown much more playing many different flutes of many different kinds than I ever have when I played just one flute exclusively.
After all, if I had followed almost the exact same advice from Dr. Steinquest in 1985, I’d have never picked up the wooden flute at all.
As to the usefullness or not of the comparisons, I have had much feedback that they are worthwhile–including some names I was surprised by–and very little that they are not. So, respectfully, while I understand your position I will continue to post them here unless Dale or Rich asks me to stop.
–James
I think it’s probably apropos to point out that no one has asked that James halt posting these comparisons, or clips of his playing; in fact, it appears that even those who’ve noted that they don’t think the comparisons are very helpful have been very careful to say that they think it’s fine that you (James) are posting them.
Posts to a public board, though, especially one regarding a subject dear to many folks and about which there are pretty divergent opinions, are bound to attract some disagreement, and I think the disagreements in this thread are actually helpful, too, and not at all unfriendly or unuseful. In fact, the thread is far more enlightening, engaging, and informative because of the responses. It’s one of the things about public forums that’s a real benefit, and a truly democratic debate.
I know it’s easy to get one’s hackles up when anything other than praise or thanks attends a performance or one’s writing, but that’s what this board is supposed to allow. Please keep posting your stuff, and those of you who disagree, please keep posting your opinions, too. I’ve learned much more from threads like this than I have from those that are just a series of “Wow, thanks!” and “Great tune!” replies. Gordon’s and Stuart’s replies are intelligent and carry good weight, considering their experience and knowledge. Thanks, guys!
But your posts are useful, too, James, and this one introduced a new tune to me, so also: Thanks, James! I’m going to try to pick that one up tonight.
–Aaron