Do any recordings of John Keenan Sr., Paddy’s father, exist? He seems to be a bit neglected as a player and influence in piping.
Andrew
If memory serves me correctly (and it did once, I think…) did he not play on that first PK album (“The Brown Album” in vernacular)? Was it banjo?
T
Yes, banjo on a track or two. But I think the question was referring to Keenan Sr. playing pipes. I am not aware of any recordings of this.
djm
Or perhaps it was john keenan jr playing banjo?..
Is John Sr or Jr (i.e. Johnny) who plays the banjo on that album? I thought it was Jnr.
That website AlanB posted has a well-written biography of the Keenan family for those, like me, who aren’t very knowledgeable about the histories of many musicians and the people they played with over the years.
It was Johnny Jr. on the Paddy Keenan album. Paddy Keenan wrote a tune for him (Brother John) and one for his father also.
It seems to me that John Keenan Sr. must have had a big influence on modern piping – he taught Paddy Keenan, Finbar Furey and Davy Spillane after all – but he seems to go unnoticed.
Andrew
I heard somewhere that John Sr. knew Johnny Doran or learned piping with or from him, or something.
OK
I met John Keenan (Senior) at (UP maker) Matt Keirnan’s house in Cabra, Dublin, in 1973. John was very interested in my N. Small Pipes, as he had been making a few N. Small Pipes (and not very good, the one I saw that a Scots piper,Peter Banks, had in L.A. circa 1972) Just that year, I had written to John about his prices for pipes, and I remember part of the complicated address: such and such a Road, Sherlock, Co. Cavan, via Dundalk. His rubber stamp on the envelope read: John Keenan, maker of Uilleann, Northumbrian, and Scots Lowland Pipes. I think he was getting ready for the BIG BOOM in Piping!
(It WAS a slow start, really slow!)
Anyhow, when I met John, he wanted to hear the set I had bought from Colin Ross, just 2 weeks before my 1st visit to Dublin, and which I could barely play. I was practicing like a madman though, and I had started with the GHB in 1970, so it wasn’t THAT bad. John and Matt both liked the fact that I could play and sing at the same time,“like the OLD pipers”, they had known in their youth. When I asked John to play, he demurred as he didn’t have his set with him and he didn’t want to play Matt’s own half set, which Matt offered him.
So Matt played HIS favorite tunes by the light of the fire, and John just leaned back and listened. He didn’t mention his son Paddy, or John Jr. (also known as Sean Keenan, RIP)or the rest of that family of musicians. When I met Paddy in 1975, I didn’t put it together for along time, that I had met his Dad, John, 2 years before.
Sometime around 1979, I met whistle player Eve Brotman,who had been married to Sean and had a boy, Sean Jr. I hope he’s got the Keenan Music Gift! I haven’t seen Eve in along time now I heard that she had become a piano tuner in New York City. I also hear that there’s an Irish Banjo Festival in Sean Keenan’s memory, and I bet that it’s a good one!..I love the combination of UPs and Banjos! Paddy Keenan AND “banjo” Seamus Egan are great together! Sean Folsom
Addendum to the post above, DMQ remembers that it was Michael Keenan and not John Keenan, who was the pipemaker, anyway, I remember it was John Keenan I was introduced to and my now befuddled memories are just that. It’s what I get for living into my 56th year! Wires Crossed Sean Folsom
I ran into a man in Great Bend, Kansas who is a second cousin of John Keenan, snr.
Small world.
Tommy
Although I never heard John Keenan play the pipes I did have a strange meeting with him around 1973. His son, Paddy, got word that I had made a bag for Seamus Ennis out of Naugahyde (plastic). Paddy, up until that time had been using rubber to make his bags. I sent word for Paddy to meet me at Donahue’s pub in Dublin. When Paddy showed up he had his dad and one of his brothers with him. Paddy introduced me to his dad who immediately said “ Nobody touches Paddy’s Pipes” I was some what taken aback, I could see that Paddy was embarrassed and rather than get into bad words I told his dad that I could draw out a diagram for making the bag and that he and Paddy could make one themselves. We sat in a booth and I gave him a list of materials and drew a diagram for cutting the bag and how to put on a couple of layers of contact cement. We then joked a bit, had a pint or two and away they went. The next time I saw Paddy he was raving about the plastic bag and he is still using them to this day. He says that he likes the spongey stretchy feeling of the synthetic leather. Also they are very inexpensive. As far as I know those were the first plastic bags ever made for the U.pipes.
Sean—you are the first person to ever mention John Keenan the pipe maker from Northern Ireland. I used to make him batches of reeds and mail them to him. I would get these scratchy letters humorous letters from him asking for another batch. By the way I was charging $.50 cents per reed. Time have changed.
All the best,
Pat Sky
Sorryyyyy,
I ment Michael Keenan Pipemaker. The Keenans ar a confusing lot.
Pat Sky
Thanks Pat, for the reminisence! I’m trying to contact Paddy (himself) to clear up the mystery! I played on the pink (hot water bottle) rubber bag and bellows from Kennedy, but the first synthetic bag material I ever saw on Ups, was Ivan Donaldson’s 1959 Rowsome set, which had a “MacKintosh” material bag on it. This Rowsome set is now the one that Tommy Creagan plays (that Dublin man in Seattle), after lots of back and forth ownerships (including Ted Anderson). I offered Donaldson $500 for it (1975) he just laughed, as his M.O. was to merely dangle it in front of pipers who would visit him (Ivan couldn’t play a single note on 'em, of course). Turns out that it’s a slightly sharp set, and the MacKintosh bag had disintegrated at the time of my visit, but now, re-reeded and re-bag-ed, it “shines”, in the hands of PIPER Creagan! Sean Folsom
Sean…in case you missed it, Ted tells the story here a couple years ago…
- “Ivan Donaldson was a fisheries biologist at the Bonneville dam and lived in Stevenson since the late 30’s. He ordered and got a concert set from Leo Rowsome in the 50’s. He did not learn to play it and it showed signs of work by M. Kennedy of Cork. Sean Folsom, and most west coast pipers, tried to obtain the set…” [u]click here for rest of story[/u]
Slightly OT but here’s a 5 minute interview by NPR news with Paddy Keenan (March 2003) in which he talks a little about the Long Grazing Acre, his Williams set and De Barra’s pub.
I have the “UPDATE” on this post, after talking to Paddy Keenan on the phone today (Monday, Feb. 13th, 2006). I asked Paddy if his father made pipes, and Yes, John Keenan Sr. made pipes, including a bronze chanter with Ivory mounts that Paddy just got back in his posession recently. Yes, John Keenan Sr. WAS a frequent visitor to Matt Kiernan’s house in Cabra, Dublin. John would make chanters, bellows and other parts on Matt’s equipment. Did John Sr. have North hUmbrian Small Pipes? Yes, Paddy had been given a set of these Small pipes, as a gift , which Paddy had then passed along to his father. These same NUSPs have recently been returned to Paddy’s hands, as well. They have some missing bits, that probably weren’t there when Paddy got a hold of the set, way back in the past. This is probably why I remember John Sr. wanting to measure some of the parts of my NUSPs…I asked Paddy if he knew of Michael Keenan the pipe maker in Sherlock, co. Cavan, via Dundalk? “Never heard of him”, said Paddy. So I will observe that there are alot of Keenans in the world, and some members “of the family name”, are pipers, and pipe makers, and not all of the Keenans know each other ! I admit, I did, in my mind, confound John Keenan Sr., with Michael Keenan of co.Cavan.
This was some years after the meetings I had with John Keenan Sr., in 1973, at Matt’s house.
I never had a face to face meeting with Michael Keenan. I had only read his name and address on some envelopes, and examined Michael Keenan’s Northumbrian Small Pipes. This set in particular, was a heap of rubbish, a dog’s breakfast, and other Brit. descriptive phrases, etc.
This ends most of the mystery, unless someone knows more…?
On the UP-swing Paddy just got back from a trip to Mali, Africa, where he was involved with a documentary film expedition. The cross-cultural exchange with other traditional musicians, walking out into the Sahara Dessert, a visit to “Tim-Buck-Two”…I am sure, anybody going to his Feb. gigs in New England, will hear about the specifics of his visit to THAT city, and if he doesn’t say anything, ASK HIM about what happened to Paddy on that leg of the trip, it’s hilarious…! Thanks, Paddy for the craic
Sean (flawed memory) Folsom
P.S. I just re-read the thread and I forgot to ask Paddy if his father ever recorded any of his piping…just can’t think of everything SF