Hmmm. I’ve recently begun having some jaw pain (not TMJ, I hope) after playing. I’ve played Boehm flute for 25+ years and never had trouble. I think I’ve been tensing my jaw in trying to get a “darker” or harder sound. So, I’m trying to stop doing that!
Has anyone had any experience with this? Should I stop playing for awhile? Or just try to relax and not move my jaw when playing?
Thanks for any feedback, Jeanie
My jaw often gets sore after playing for a while, but it never lasts. I guess it just means developing certain muscles, so that it won’t happen, right?
Max
Never had it, touch wood, however I do
think the first line of defense is to stop
for a couple of days. In case something
is strained that needs to heal.
I think I’ve been tensing my jaw in trying to get a “darker” or harder sound. So, I’m trying to stop doing that!
I’ve never had the jaw pain problem and I do use slight jaw jutt (out a tad for higher and in a tad for lower notes). I’d recommend staying relaxed, however, and using your lips more for stronger “darker” sounds.
BillG
I reckon you’re right handed and its your left jaw that hurts.
If so, its to do with left neck muscle/ligament strain due to your head tilt/twist while playing.
You may need to adjust your posture but first do what Jim says - a couple of days break. Get some DMT or physiotherapy and and take your flute along to the therapist so your playing posture can be reviewed.
I am making radical changes to my posture after observing a bass bansuri player (the flute was over 82 cm long) playing the instrument 3 hours non stop in a state of relaxation (in terms of neck tension). If he can do it with an A bansuri well I reckon I can do it with the D Irish flute.
Musicians need to be dancers also.
Merry Postures to all.
Well, if it happens after playing, then something you are doing while playing is the cause! As much as it may upset you to have it associated with your flute, it’s really a good thing, because you’ll be able to watch yourself while playing to see what’s causing it. Once you know what it is, you can avoid it.
If you’ve been playing Boehm flute for 25 years, something you are doing now, with the wooden flute, is different and that is likely to be the cause of your trouble. From your post, it looks like you already identified it.
As you know, the jaw opens and closes. We often think of this as occurring only vertically, but it also involves sideways motion. The lower jaw goes up and down, and to the left, and to the right. The muscles and ligaments which accomplish these actions can become strained and painful.
If you went out and ran too far, or climbed too many stairs, you’d expect soreness in your legs. In the same fashion, if you do too many repetitions of opening and closing, or lefting and righting, with your lower jaw, you’ll experience soreness. Think about it–if you chew gum too much, the muscles that open and close your jaw become sore. You’ll also get sore muscles if you keep them tense–think about the stiff neck and pain you can get from holding your head wrong for too long.
As has been suggested, a few days’ rest isn’t such a bad idea. You might also benefit from some ice to the area, perhaps alternated with a hot pack.
Relaxation, as Tal mentioned, is going to help. He’s also right about everything else he said.
Stretching will help, too. Muscles that get too tight hurt, and when they get too tight, they don’t relax, and that makes it easier to strain or injure them the next time, thus causing a vicious cycle. There are TMJ exercises and stretches on the net, but see if a plain old yawn helps.
Yawning is a great stretch. Even if you try to open your jaw as far as you can, a yawn usually does better. It’s hard to overstretch with a yawn, too.
A little massage will help, and I’ll tell you how to do that yourself. It’s really very easy, as you can get to the muscles involved all by yourself! This is an inside-outside affair, so you put one finger inside your mouth and one outside. That enables you to massage by working the muscle between your fingers.
If this is the left side, put your left hand up to your cheek. The index finger goes inside, between your back teeth and your cheek. The thumb is at the same place on the outside. Just pinch lightly. There is a strip of muscle running from about your cheekbone to your lower jaw. That’s the culprit.
You can feel it easily if you clench your jaw. You’ll feel it as it contracts and crushes your finger into your teeth. Once you’ve found it, you can massage it. Pinching it between your fingers, start as high up as you can reach and drag down as low as you can go. Move to a different spot and repeat. Keep doing that until you’ve done the whole muscle. Not too hard, either, so that you don’t cause pain just by squashing it.
This should help. It’s not likely to hurt. But, of course, here is the usual disclaimer to see a physician, etc., etc. If you are in the US, some massage therapists can help with this problem and others cannot, but if you can find one, it’s worth a visit. I don’t gather from your post that you’re that far gone, though.
Peggy,
Thanks for the advice! I will certainly try the massage exercise you recommend. I don’t think the problem is too serious yet, and I don’t want it to go further. So I appreciate it.
Merry Christmas, Jeanie
Oddly enough, this past week I was able to dislocate my jaw. I could feel the displacement when I opened my mouth. I could hear a crunch as my jaw moved out and back in; I could do it at will. There was some discomfort.
I was worried that the hours of playing I’ve been doing lately might be a causal factor and that I’d have to play a different instrument. Since then I’ve avoided displacing my jaw, needless to say. I haven’t cut back on my playing time. There is still some discomfort back there (no real pain) and I try for a slacker, softer embouchure. I played for four hours in the pub last night and this morning I felt some soreness. The massage helped, so thanks for that.
Where’s a doc when we need one? Stu…? Frank…?
Yes, the jaw massage definitely makes it feel better. David, I think what you said about a “slacker, softer” embouchure is key. When I felt the pain while playing, I would try to slacken my jaw and get a softer embouchure, and the pain would decrease. I’m going to still hold off playing another day or two.
That jaw displacement sounds painful!
Generally speaking, if you focus on this sort of thing enough, as you will if you’re worried about it, you can get any and all sorts of noises to occur. Best that you not try to produce them, because it makes things worse. It can become fascinating to make these noises, especially after you discover how to make them rhythmically and in different tones, so get a grip and just stop it.
You both did very well with the massage! I’m impressed! I’ll give you a little stretch, too. It’s a very easy stretch and nearly impossible to over-do. Notice I said “nearly impossible.” It is possible to go overboard with it, so keep it reined in.
Relaxed muscles are better than clenched, tight muscles. Much less painful. They have more range of action, which is a good thing. When those muscles get tight, you won’t be able to open your mouth as far as you should. Relaxed muscles allow you to open your mouth more.
When you exercise, you stretch, right? It may be that when you play your flute a lot, you are exercising too much and not getting that stretch. So, we’ll stretch after playing. This can relieve some of that pain, too, so you might do it at other times, as well.
What you’ll do is fool your muscles into relaxing and stretching. It’s very easy. You’'re going to bite down and then stretch a little, then bite a little more, then stretch. (You may have seen this in a sports context–it’s the same idea.)
To start off, open your mouth and see how many knuckles you can fit between your front teeth comfortably. Vertically, that is. One? Two? Three? The tighter you are, the fewer knuckles you can fit. (The maximum depends on you, so there is no “best” number of knuckles.) No cramming–just fit as many as will comfortably fit.
How many knuckles did you get in there? Make a note of that. Now, bite gently–straight up and down, not half sideways–for a count of ten. Biiiiiiiiiite, then relax. Now, using your fingers, very gently assist your jaw in opening a bit further. Puuuuush, then hold. Keep the fingers at that distance.
You’ll notice that it WILL open a bit more. If you could get two knuckles in before, you’d be able to get two and a smidge more.
Now repeat that. Holding your teeth open still–it should still be comfortable–biiiiiiiiiiite. Count to ten. Now, relax and use your fingers to open your jaw a bit more. Puuuuush. You’ll get a smidge more. Repeat this a couple more times, until you’ve reached as far as you can comfortably go. (More is not better. Underdo it. Just as you do not play faster than your technique can handle, do not stretch further than your muscles will allow.)
After you do this, you’ll notice that your jaw seems more relaxed and loose, because it is.
This stretch should be done in a very relaxed, meditative manner. Sloooooow relaxed rhythm. Like waves rolling onto a beach in slow motion. Visualize and/or hear that and keep time with it. Nothing you do with this stretch should cause pain. Don’t go that far. If it hurts, stop.
Are you grinding your teeth at night?
I have TMJ. I believe it is mostly hereditary, but I think the braces aggrivated it, and the flute playing doesn’t help. It makes playing the flute a real pain. Especially when it is colder out, there are some days where I do all I can to avoid playing.
I had to go to physical therapy last year for it, and here are a few things I did.
A)Massage the outside of your cheek, right by your ear. Relax your jaw at the same time and work the spot that hurts.
B)Open your jaw about halfway and slowly move it from side to side.
C)Same as B, but move forward and backward.
D)Put heat on the outside of your jaw.
E)Massage the inside of your jaw behind your gums wherever it hurts.
F)Tension in your neck and face can make a big difference in your jaw. Try to relax these areas.
I hope some of that helps. (I’m not an expert on this by any means.) Pray that you do not have a bad TMJ. (I still cannot eat a whole apple, and about a year ago I thought that foods such as ritz crackers were way too hard.)
My jaw pain has been lessening, due to the useful tips of the several post-ers in this thread. I didn’t play for two days, and when I did play again yesterday, I made sure to keep my jaw more slack and my embouchure “softer.” So far so good.
I went to the dentist today, though, for a regular cleaning, and explained the problem I’d had to her. She said, “Are you going to keep playing that instrument?” with a look at me like this 
.
I replied, “YES! I’m certainly going to try!” “‘That instrument’”! Non-musicians just can’t understand how much we love playing!
So, I’m praying that my pain does not return. Thanks to all for the suggestions. Jeanie
A long story that eventually has a point …
When I got my Murray I remember the girl I bought it from told me Sam Murray had asked her which shoulder she played on (I guess so he could configure the blowhole cut correctly for a right- or left-handed player), and I thought “What? How could ANYONE play while resting these things’ headjoints on their shoulders?”
Well. The first time I played the Murray, guess what. Suddenly I found myself tucking it in onto my right shoulder just like lots of those Irish folks I’d seen in pictures and had always thought were just wrong. I HAD NEVER DONE THIS IN HOW MANY? – 25 YEARS? – OF PLAYING.
What the ???
But then, when I held the Murray up against my Hammy … AHA! Mystery solved. Turns out the Murray’s head joint is considerably longer (with most of the additional length between the blowhole and the end cap), which shifts the balance slightly toward the head end – just enough that putting it on my shoulder seemed perfectly natural. This does not happen, or really even work when I try it, with either my McGee or the Hammy.
But anyway, I try not to do that too much unless I’m tired or feeling especially shy in sessions … but ANYWAY … in trying to avoid tucking the flute in between my chin and shoulder, I found I was really pushing it into my jaw for support.
So I don’t know how your Copley’s built in terms of HJ length, but that might be a consideration to compensate for, especially if you have no problems with your Burns. (Might also be interesting to lay the two side by side and see …)
Like I said, it was a weird observation, but it proved useful for me … now, when I play the Murray, I just try to be more aware of supporting more (but not gripping!) with my left hand and arm. (Or I just let it hang out on my shoulder, but after a while this can kink up my neck.)
Anyway, hope this helps, but definitely make sure you’re not pushing into your jaw too hard to get those edgier low notes, esp. if your flute’s a bit long in the head joint.
Then again, this could all be useless. 
But meanwhile, I’m glad you’re feeling better!
cat.
My dentist, ( a splendid fellow if not consulted on cosmetic work on ivory )
mentioned just how severe can be the knock on effect in jaw pain of a tiny bite problem of two teeth touching which might go unobserved.
I find that most of my jaw pain comes from merely talking about flutes !
I guess I forgot a couple important things…
G)Take a look at how you open your mouth. When my TMJ started to get bad, I opened my mouth almost all the way, and then at the last minute, I swung my jaw to the side. If your jaw doesn’t open strait (especially if it really veers off to one side) talk to your dentist 'cause this could be a sign.
H)Measure the opening of your jaw. I don’t remember what’s normal, but for me, 25 mm is really good. When you slide your jaw horizontally, I think it should be at least 5 mm. I’ve been trying to keep track of how I’m doing with this, especially since it gets waaaaay worse in winter when it is cold. If anything suddenly changes, get it looked at right away before it gets bad. (Again I do not claim to be a doctor, but it is miserable eating only applesauce, pudding, and yougurt for a month. 
)
Hi Hoovorff,
I had my TMJ corrected about 20 years ago. The dentist made a appliance out of plastic that I had to wear for 6 months. What it did was change the bite, so that it pulled the jaw bone away from the TMJ joint.
Indicatons of TMJ are often: clicking in the joint. When the jaw is closed it may have a “C” closure, the jaw goes over to one side when closing.
Hopefully you don’t have this, but you should have a good dentist look at it.
Good luck!
Jon C.