Improvisation of variations is a fundamental, integral part of playing both the dance forms and airs (not aires) that you cite. Most good players seldom play a tune the same way twice through. So the question is more: Has anybody not etc.
If by improv you mean jazz-style soloing over a chord progression, that doesn’t really apply. Because in a monophonic tradition like Irish trad, there’s no inherent chord progression. If you’re free-form soloing over an imagined progression, or even an actual accompaniment, to the point that you’re not playing the core melody of a tune, then you’re simply not playing the tune. You’re playing something else.
Can you improvise your own jigs, reels etc. on the fly? Sure, some can. That’s one way that new tunes are born, on pipes or any other instrument.
Can you play jazz improv on the pipes? Sure, why not, within the diatonic limitations of the instrument or your fingering. But that’s not jigs, reels etc., so that doesn’t seem to be the question either.
There’s a fairly well-known recording of someone playing 12-bar blues on the pipes, but my memory banks fail me.
Ah, it’s Jerry O’Sullivan I’m thinking of: Noel McCarthy’s Jig from his “The Gift” album, track 7. But it’s clearly a composed tune in the style of a blues jam, not an improv. A couple of YouTubers attempted to cover it, e.g.:
Similarly with the tune “Clear Blue Sky” from the same album (track 9). The arrangement is classic jazz trio (piano, bass, drums) plus pipes lead (as opposed to lead pipes). But the pipes just play the head both in and out, and not improv choruses.
Anyone can play any type of music they want on any instrument they want, if they can find a way to do it. I don’t think the instrument is what makes it possible/impossible, but that rather falls on the individual player how well it will turn out. A fully keyed chanter really offers a lot of possibilities with what range it does have, and I would not say it’s restricted from playing jazz. Depending on what the piper is wanting to play. Also, just becuase one or two guys might have tried it and failed horribly, does not mean that’s how it’s going to turn out in every case of it being attempted.
Bluegrass on the trombone? Well, if somebody can find a way to do it, and wants to do it, no problem with that. Although, bluegrass is more of a traditionally rooted style. I think implementing any instrument in jazz would be even less extreme than the bluegrass on trombone, because jazz tends to lend itself well to new innovations in instruments, due to the nature of what jazz is. I think a group of people playing jazz would be a lot less restrictive on what instruments they would disallow.
I have no problems with hearing uilleann pipes in other genres of music, just as I am sure many people have no problem with many of the instruments within irish trad having come out of other styles and other lands.
I never heard any jazz fans complain about tenor banjo being used in irish trad (not saying they haven’t), but perhaps it’s a fair swap .
I played some modern free improvised music for a while. That worked, but not really well. As long as the Center of Gravity was around d it was nice, but when other Group members moved to another key the pipes sound more or less wrong. Hmmm, O.K. there is no “wrong” in this type of music, but it sounds like crap to me.
improvisation of Jigs, reels, hornpipes? Somtimes when I totally loose the tune, I play whatever comes in mind. Nobody really notices, except some friend who know how I use to play the tunes I play. Great Fun sometimes!
I have heard that the heart of good piping is variation. Perhaps that is the UP form of improv in its most widely accepted (?). There is, of course, a line where the variation clearly crosses over into the territory of terra improva. I leave that to others to decide where these two lands lie.
I’m sorry but the Rufus Harley stuff if dire, a total abomination of the highland pipes. Absolutely awful.
The Uilleann pipes are very limited for soloing as they have no dynamics, the Highland pipes are even more limited as they only have 9 - 11 notes, the tone in continuous AND they have no dynamics. Pipes are great at what they do, guitars are crap at what pipes do.
When were dynamics ever a requirement in playing
jazz or traditional music for that matter?
Pipes are great at what they do and Rufus vastly
extended that greatness.
From the dire, po-faced classical piping point of view yes.
Rufus never made any claim of being anything other than a jazz musician.
He took the instrument to a place no one else prior had considered
and from the jazz aspect made a simple instrument play some
very complicated improvisational music that no highland piper
ever could conceive. There’s a lot more going on in the playing
beyond intonation, fingering, embellishments or any other thing
that one might abominate. If he was playing traditional music it
would be a different story. Thanks to Rufus for liberating the instrument.
might as well be.
WHY do ya have a spare ticket?
thinkin I’ll take you up on it!
I want it known though, that I didnt start this ok?
All in your own opinion of course, right, bogman?
I have some questions for you, if youd care to answer:
1.) have you played with Rufus Harley? (because I have)
2.) can you play, note for note, his solo from “Eight Miles High”? (its a toughie- warnin ya!)
3.) have you ever considered, even for a moment, that there may be more to ‘what makes good bagpiping’ than the narrow definition you’ve outlined ? (unless anachronistic musical necrology is your thing)
Im stopping now (somone else can pick your post apart), because i know there isnt a shred of truth there, & its a waste of time to convince somone online of the opposite.
It s nothing personal. "peace & " (as Rufus would often say)
Believe what you want to.
PS Oloerez, yah he would have gone nuts for the kind of quality pipes we have today. Those old Hardies’ were best at the time.
I thought the point was about improvisation as in the soloing sense in more standard music rather than the micro improvisation common in trad? Can you point to a jazz solo with no dynamics?
As to the second points - “no highland piper ever could conceive” - wow, derogatory! -Martyn Bennett, Fraser Fifield and many more?
Edit: - do you think this guys “couldn’t conceive” for example http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-UJwh7tR36o
You’re right though, there’s a lot more going on other than intonation etc, whether it’s any good or not we’re never going to agree.
Chas, the obvious comeback However, I’m afraid you’ll be waiting a long time.