Hello! New with a few questions...(warning, novel)

Whistle
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Hi! I just bought my first whistles, a Clarke Sweetone Soprano D (metal) and a Dixon Soprano D (plastic). I’ve played saxophone for many years, but I’m totally new to whistle and don’t have a teacher. Things are going pretty well so far, adjusting to the fingerings, etc. But I have a few questions that maybe you more knowledgeable souls can answer for me.

First of all, I’m having a few problems with my “D’s”. I’m willing to bet this is a common problem, but the low D is really hard to hit, especially with the Dixon. The middle D is okay, but it’s reedy. Some of the other notes tend to be reedy too, especially with the Dixon. Are there any ways to address these problems?

Second is about embouchere…I’m not exactly sure how to hold it in my mouth. Do I clasp it between my teeth or lips? My natural inclination is to have contact with my upper teeth and hold it loosely with the bottom lip (but not folded over the bottom teeth as in a saxophone).

Third is about intonation…I’ve noticed the lower register is out of tune with the upper register. Is there any way to adjust this with my embouchere? I haven’t had a lot of success with this.

Fourth is about vibrato. How is this done with a whistle? It seems to me the only way to do it is from the diaphragm, but are there other ways?

Fifth, I think I like the Sweetone better than the Dixon, but how do I take it back from my six-year old? Also it’s not tunable, and I like a tunable instrument. Are there other whistles that can be recommended that give a nice strong tone like the Sweetone, but that are tunable? (I’m sure I’m opening a huge can of worms with this one!!) And, how do I get the reediness out of the Dixon? This isn’t a nice reediness, but kind of a wimpiness/spit sound, although I don’t think it’s actually from moisture but from how I am playing.

Any and all suggestions welcome! Thanks a lot!

Robin

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Hi Robin

I know nothing about Dixons, never having so much as seen one. But the problem most people have with sounding the low D is that they blow too hard. Could this be problem in your case?

The most common problem with intonation between the two registers is that the second octave tends to be flat, esp. in whistles with a cylindrical bore. You can correct this to a large extent, but perhaps not completely, by blowing harder, esp. as you go higher up the scale.

In general I don’t think you can do much to change the tone of individual notes - but different players get very different sounds out of the same whistle.

In your mouth - most people will tell you to keep your teeth out of the way, and so would I. But a whistlemaker recently told me that two of the best-known and most highly skilled players out there grip their aluminum whistles firmly between their teeth. So go figure.

Vibrato - try the search feature. The question comes up regularly. You can use diaphragm, finger waving, or throat-bleating. (I’m not a big fan of vibrato on the whistle, as you might gather!)

As for different whistles… you’ll get a few suggestions I think.

HTH
Steve

On 2003-01-02 12:29, spittin_in_the_wind wrote:
Hi! I just bought my first whistles, a Clarke Sweetone Soprano D (metal) and a Dixon Soprano D (plastic). I’ve played saxophone for many years, but I’m totally new to whistle and don’t have a teacher. Things are going pretty well so far, adjusting to the fingerings, etc. But I have a few questions that maybe you more knowledgeable souls can answer for me.

First of all, I’m having a few problems with my “D’s”. I’m willing to bet this is a common problem, but the low D is really hard to hit, especially with the Dixon. The middle D is okay, but it’s reedy. Some of the other notes tend to be reedy too, especially with the Dixon. Are there any ways to address these problems?

Second is about embouchere…I’m not exactly sure how to hold it in my mouth. Do I clasp it between my teeth or lips? My natural inclination is to have contact with my upper teeth and hold it loosely with the bottom lip (but not folded over the bottom teeth as in a saxophone).

Third is about intonation…I’ve noticed the lower register is out of tune with the upper register. Is there any way to adjust this with my embouchere? I haven’t had a lot of success with this.

Fourth is about vibrato. How is this done with a whistle? It seems to me the only way to do it is from the diaphragm, but are there other ways?

Fifth, I think I like the Sweetone better than the Dixon, but how do I take it back from my six-year old? Also it’s not tunable, and I like a tunable instrument. Are there other whistles that can be recommended that give a nice strong tone like the Sweetone, but that are tunable? (I’m sure I’m opening a huge can of worms with this one!!) And, how do I get the reediness out of the Dixon? This isn’t a nice reediness, but kind of a wimpiness/spit sound, although I don’t think it’s actually from moisture but from how I am playing.

Any and all suggestions welcome! Thanks a lot!

Robin

3

On 2003-01-02 12:29, spittin_in_the_wind wrote:
Hi! I just bought my first whistles, a Clarke Sweetone Soprano D (metal) and a Dixon Soprano D (plastic). I’ve played saxophone for many years, but I’m totally new to whistle and don’t have a teacher.

Cead mile failte, Robin! So, you don’t have a teacher? We’ll fix you up right here! :smiley:

Things are going pretty well so far, adjusting to the fingerings, etc. But I have a few questions that maybe you more knowledgeable souls can answer for me.

First of all, I’m having a few problems with my “D’s”. I’m willing to bet this is a common problem, but the low D is really hard to hit, especially with the Dixon. The middle D is okay, but it’s reedy. Some of the other notes tend to be reedy too, especially with the Dixon. Are there any ways to address these problems?

I don’t have any experience with Dixon high D’s, but I do have an Oak high D and a Dixon low G. Unlike the Clarke, both of these have LOW breath requirements, and are very picky about breath control. Also, to get a good bell (lowest) tone, you must make sure all of the holes are sealed, or it will squawk at you. My Dixon low G has a somewhat reedy sound, too, but to me, this is desirable in a low whistle.

Second is about embouchere…I’m not exactly sure how to hold it in my mouth. Do I clasp it between my teeth or lips? My natural inclination is to have contact with my upper teeth and hold it loosely with the bottom lip (but not folded over the bottom teeth as in a saxophone).

I usually place the mouthpiece only a short distance between my lips, and don’t touch it with my teeth. You can try both “round” and “flat” embouchures. They will make small, but perceivable, differences in your sound. Experiment and see what works best.

Third is about intonation…I’ve noticed the lower register is out of tune with the upper register. Is there any way to adjust this with my embouchere? I haven’t had a lot of success with this.

Sometimes, you can adjust this with your breath output, if it is the lower register which is out of tune, and not too severely. If it is the upper register, adjust your tuning slide until it is in tune, then deal with the lower register by breath control. If neither of these methods work, you may have a “dud”, and you might want to exchange it or “tweak” it (instructions elsewhere on this site).

Fourth is about vibrato. How is this done with a whistle? It seems to me the only way to do it is from the diaphragm, but are there other ways?

I wiggle the whistle, although this technically produces tremolo, not vibrato. You can also rapidly close and open the second open below your lowest finger for true vibrato.

Fifth, I think I like the Sweetone better than the Dixon, but how do I take it back from my six-year old? Also it’s not tunable, and I like a tunable instrument. Are there other whistles that can be recommended that give a nice strong tone like the Sweetone, but that are tunable? (I’m sure I’m opening a huge can of worms with this one!!) And, how do I get the reediness out of the Dixon? This isn’t a nice reediness, but kind of a wimpiness/spit sound, although I don’t think it’s actually from moisture but from how I am playing.

OOPS, you’ve got me there! Any suggestions?


Any and all suggestions welcome! Thanks a lot!

Robin

Check some of the links from this page. Good luck and happy whistling!

Slan leat,
BB

4

Some suggestions…

*Make sure you are covering all the holes firmly and completely. That should help in getting better notes. A good practice to help you get the low D solid every time:

Start with the top hole (B) and cover it. Blow until you get a solid, good-sounding note, and repeat several times until it sounds good every time. Then cover the top two, and do the same. Next cover the top three, and pracitce until that note sounds good. Repeat this until you are covering every note and can get that bottom D one fine every time. This really worked well for me when I started because I was having lots of trouble getting solid notes and especially the lowest one.

*You should probably hold the whistle in your lips, not your teeth. But there may be others who say “do what feels comfortable to you.” I’m not sure myself of the correct way to hold it.

*Did you try blowing harder to get the upper octave to come out sounding in tune?

how do I get the reediness out of the Dixon? This isn’t a nice reediness, but kind of a wimpiness/spit sound, although I don’t think it’s actually from moisture but from how I am playing.

*I just got two low Dixons for Christmas, and they seemed to clog fairly easily. They sound great but when they are clogged you can’t get any decent sound out of them. Try tapping your whistle against your leg several times or shake it to get any moisture out. This may reduce some of that noise, but if it isn’t coming from moisture, I don’ t know…

*There have been several helpful threads on different ways to do vibrato in the past. This one was very good, I thought:

http://chiffboard.mati.ca/viewtopic.php?topic=2241&forum=1

Good luck and welcome! :slight_smile:

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I don’t have a Dixon (yet!), but I can think of a few things that will cause an “upleasant, reedy tone” in some of my other whistles:

  1. Underblowing. This is actually kind of a misnomer, because what you want to do isn’t so much “blow harder” as “focus your air.” Try tightening your embouchure (using just the lips) and concentrating on keeping an even stream of air moving through the whistle, and see if that helps.

  2. Not covering the holes securely enough. Remember to use the pads of your fingers, not the tips. Some whistles will go noticeably sharp or flat (or just squawk) if the holes aren’t covered properly, but others will just sound kind of funny. Play a scale one note at a time, and see what you can do with your fingers and/or your airstream to adjust any odd tones you hear.

  3. Moisture. I don’t know how quickly this builds up in saxaphones (or even if it does), but it can build up almighty fast in a whistle, and before it clogs completely, it will sound rather reedy and wimpy. Someone else already mentioned how to clear it. If this proves to the be the problem you can do a couple of different things to prevent it, including the soapy strip cure mentioned on the C&F main site (it does work!)…but probably the most important thing is to make sure the whistle is properly warmed up before you play it.

As for vibrato…I tend to use the diaphragm. You can also get a tremolo effect (a trill, really) by bouncing your bottom finger up and down rapidly (best for short notes and passing tones). Right now, however, you should probably be focusing on the basics, and worry about ornamentation when you feel really secure with the instrument. There are lots of lovely ways to ornament tunes on the whistle, but get basic technique down first, is my advice.

Redwolf

6

Ok, so an update…

Thanks to you guys, I’ve solved a few things. First I warmed my Dixon up in my hands before playing it…this helped a lot with some of the off tones I was getting…I guess there must be moisture I wasn’t aware of (I’m used to being able to suck it all out on a sax!! Yummy!) I think I’m also not lifting my fingers enough and am inadvertently obstructing some of the holes. And, I’m making sure to more fully cover the holes with my fingers…Also using just the lips and no teeth, as much as possible, and opening up the throat…all these things improved the sound a LOT! Thanks a lot, I’m so happy I got so much out of one post!

Now I like my Dixon again…which is good, since my six year old lost the Sweetone tonight, and I can’t find it (even in the couch cushions). Hopefully it will turn up somewhere!

Robin

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Welcome “spittin”, from another sax player!
The thing I noticed after I started whistle-playing is that if you don’t practise your sax articulation faithfully thereafter, you really lose it because one doesn’t tongue a whole lot for whistles, esp if you’re playing Irish trad.

As for Dixons, I have them in many keys and can say with all certainty that they absolutely should not clog unless there’s something wrong with the alignment/fit of the fipple plug in the mouthpiece/barrel (happened only once to me and Tony Dixon kindly changed it at once). None of my 8 Dixons clog AT ALL save for that one that Tony changed.

However, I’ve noticed from posts on this forum that there has been more than 1 Dixon owner with this problem, and that when a Dixon does suffer from it, it’s bad and seriously affects its playability. So it’s more than just a one-off occurrence unfortunately, altho I would still say the majority of Dixon owners don’t have that problem.

I suspect the plastic rods he uses as the fipple-plug material may be mass-produced and there could be inconsistency in the dimensions (diameter) thereof. In the one whistle that clogged, I noted that there wasn’t a snug fit between the flug and the inner wall of the barrel.

Tony (if you order from him in the UK) and Thom (The Whistle Shop, USA) have good reputations for service, helpfulness, and integrity, but obviously there would be inconvenience and delay in having to change a clogging whistle.

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Thanks for the tip, Tuaz. I’m going to try a few more days and see if my changes are consistent. Then, if it still clogs a lot, I’ll give someone a call. It’s good to know that there’s a history of this, though.

Good point about the articulation. Since I haven’t really played my sax in years, I probably won’t be playing much soon. First it was too loud for apartment living, then when we had kids, it was too loud for them. Now, if I try to play, I have air shooting out the sides of my mouth within 10 minutes! I used to play with pretty stiff reeds (3-3 1/2), so I’m used to a tight embouchere. Now, with being out of shape, it’s like trying to run five miles after years of being a couch potato! One of the reasons I’ve taken up the whistle…

Now if only I can find the Sweetone…my toothbrush went missing this morning too…I think we have elves…:smiley:

Robin

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If it makes you feel better, I have one of those elves, too. Mine is about 3’ tall, blondish hair, and only plays one note on the whistle — luckily he plays it very loudly. Right now, I have a Generation D, a LBW/Generation cross also in D, and a small homemade fife which are all missing.

Apparently WHOA can start as young as 3 years of age. He’s 4 now, and also owns (on his own) a slide whistle, train whistle, and ocarina.

I, too, am a former sax player. I sold mine for money when my wife and I were married 15 years ago. I tried playing someone else’s sax about 7 years ago, and I was simply terrible…quite a humiliating experience. Luckily, I had already found the whistle quite a few years earlier so I had SOME musical self-esteem left.

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Fifth, I think I like the Sweetone better than the Dixon, but how do I take it back from my six-year old?

You don’t, you go out and buy another one, lest you stir the wrath of a small child and maybe even the mother.

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Well, I found the Sweetone…it was in my daughter’s sock drawer. Now for the toothbrush…

When I tried to steal the Sweetone from her, she tried to take the Dixon, so I guess that tact isn’t going to work. Hmmm, maybe I’ll get her a purple one, if they make them. Of course, if I ever get one of those funky Elfsongs, I’m sure she’ll want that one!

(and, I am the mother…:laughing:)