Flute tutors

Irish Flute
21

[quote="
, and, at the same time, try to keep your wrist as straight as possible. .[/quote]

HI Cork.
I tried what you said and by straightening my wrist the index finger is now flexible and the whole thing has come together. I was not turning the body of the flute far enough toward my body . Now when I look at the position it´s in when everything feel´s ok , the holes are straight . Yeepee I think I´ve started to get it. Thanks a million Cork . Im not out of the wood´s yet , but at least now I see it´s possible to use the normal grip.

B

22

OK, let’s go a little further.

Now, it’s true that people play the flute in all sorts of positions, but for now try playing in the “classical” (“up”) position, with the flute horizontal, parallel to the floor.

Your head should be up, and eyes forward, not staring at your toes, and this will help to keep your neck straight and your throat open, very important!

The flute’s embouchure hole should be in a straight line with all of the flute’s tone holes, and all of those holes should be pointing straight up.

You should be playing with both of your hands directly in front of you, not off to the side, and you’ll need to turn your head, enough that your face, and your embouchure, are “square” to the flute, facing the flute directly.

OK, so far we have talked about upper hand technique, and playing position. The next topic goes into lower hand technique, and after that perhaps embouchure.

Try thinking of a flute as being a bag of many little tricks!

Edit: About playing position, I generally play in one of two positions, the “up” position or the “down” position, and the position I mentioned above is the “up” position, aka the “classical” position. The up position is the best way to learn to play the flute, and it’s a position which should be studied, carefully, because it contains all of the best flute playing techniques. However, once those techniques are fully understood, it’s then possible to play in other positions, such as the down position, for instance, but learn the up position, first!

:wink:

23

Still having trouble with the index finger left hand. Ornamentation seems very difficult with this finger at the moment. But Im sticking with it. Also it´s difficult to maintain the horizontal to the floor flute inline with lip´s bit - Cork you said I needed to move my head , I assume that´s to a more face forward position, and not to the left as I was. I find the left arm wanders out from my body , should it remain close to the body. Straight wrist in a vertical position ? or at same angle as left arm - Help

B

24

I’m laughing, and that’s because I’ve just handed you a difficult assignment, but if you really want to learn, then this is where it begins. Let me add, that only a professional player would be seen in public while playing a flute in the up position, as all Kool Kats play in the down position, naturally, but since nobody’s going to see what you’re doing when you’re at home, I’ll go back to what I was saying about learning the up position, first.

That said, expect all of this to take some time to get used to. This simply will not happen overnight, not at all! Frankly, even a really good flute student could expect to spend a few months at daily practice before all of this classical technique could begin to make sense.

Now, let me get to your specific concerns, with the understanding that nobody ever said that playing a flute could be a “natural” thing to do!

Like a number of other things, the upper hand index finger, being so bent, simply will take some time to adapt. Don’t rush it. It’s far better for your long term physical health to simply wait for that finger to get used to its new job. In time, it will. Be patient!

About turning one’s head, this has to do with keeping one’s hands directly in front of themselves. Long story short, one’s hand position does two things, 1) it allows for the most relaxed arm position, which in turn allows for the most flexible finger technique, and 2) it also allows for the best breathing position, and that’s really important. This is one of those things which will become more obvious to you once you have become more familiar with it. So, keep your hands directly in front of yourself, and, for a right handed player, turn your head far enough to the left to keep your embouchure “square” to the flute. Also, remember to keep your head up, not facing downwards, and this will help you to keep your throat open, which will make better sense to you, soon.

About the arms, what we’re going for is a playing position which keeps both of your wrists as straight as possible, perhaps not perfectly straight, but as straight as possible. That also means that both of your arms will be at roughly the same angle, such that both of your elbows will be at roughly the same height.

Of course, we haven’t talked about the lower hand, yet.

Hang in there!

25

Straight wrist´s . The left hand is no problem , but right arm being at roughly 45° , the right wrist is at a steeper angle . Im still not getting much flexibility in the right index finger .

Please elaborate about the left hand please.

Wow this flute playing is a fascinating subject. I never would have guessed it contained so much detail.

B

26

You’ve heard about “air” guitar, where somebody pretends to play a guitar which they’re not actually holding? Well, in regard to the detail you spoke of, once you’ve become very familiar with your flute, you could then hold your arms and fingers up, such as to play “air” flute, somebody could then put an actual flute into your hands, and it would fit exactly into place, without your moving a single muscle! That’s how close your flute will become to you.

You mentioned that your RH wrist is at a “steeper” angle, and I’m going to assume that you’re still using a piper’s grip, there. Near the beginning of this thread I mentioned that apparently many pipers and whistle players have adapted a piper’s grip to the transverse flute, but, when a pipe gets turned sideways, things change, and now it’s time for you to consider a new RH grip. Ready?

On the RH, as your lower hand, you’ll need to do two things. 1) Flatten your hand. This will allow your fingers to spread out. 2) While your hand is flattened, turn your thumb so that the tip of the thumb is roughly between the first and the second fingers. Maybe you’re wondering how this unusual position could be useful, but there is a reason. You’re going to “hold” the flute on just the tip of your RH thumb, and the reason why the thumb has such a position has to do with “balancing” the RH wrist. For instance, if you were to hold your thumb to the side of your hand and then use it like that to support the flute, it would cause an imbalance to your wrist, causing your wrist to turn away from you, sideways, such that certain muscles would then be needed in order to keep your wrist straight, and that’s not good. However, by tucking your thumb under your hand, as above, far less effort is required to keep your wrist straight, and that’s a good thing. Now, what I’ve just mentioned perhaps could be a difficult concept to grasp, so it’s probably a good idea to find some YouTube clips which feature “classical” flute players, and to see just how they do it.

By using this kind of RH grip, you’ll find that your RH wrist will be quite straight. Again, the object is to get both wrists as straight as possible.

Edit#2: Unlike the piper’s grip, the “normal” transverse flute grip has all of the fingers at least somewhat curved, not straight, including that stretched L3 finger I earlier mentioned. And, when lifting the fingers, the idea is to lift them only enough to fully vent the tone holes, no more than that, and this eventually will help to increase your finger speed. Now, you may have noticed that some traditional ITM players sometimes lift their fingers much higher than that, but here, in these posts, I’m speaking of classical technique, only, and not of ITM technique. So, for the purpose of learning to play the transverse flute, I’d suggest first learning classical finger technique, such as keeping the fingers close to the tone holes, before going on to more specialized techniques, such as those of ITM. That way, the odds are that you’ll more quickly master finger articulation (all these new words!). It’s like learning the “correct” rules first, before going on to learning how to break those same rules.

Another thing to mention has to do with how the RH, the LH, and the chin all work together, to support the flute. For instance, the chin and the RH, at the thumb, combine with each other to push in one direction, while the LH, at the base of the index finger, pushes in exactly the opposite direction. Remember, the flute itself is not all that heavy, and you’ll likely find that it takes more strength just to hold your arms up, than it does to hold the flute. Edit: The overall idea, here, is to coordinate the chin, the LH, and the RH as something of a team, as it takes all three working together to successfully hold a flute.

OK, we’ve now covered a lot of ground, indeed, you now have a complete, working picture of how to hold a transverse flute correctly, and that’s a major accomplishment!

Again, as so many flute students could know, it simply will take time to understand all of what’s going on, to develop the techniques involved, and to develop the strengths required. Practically speaking, it could take a few months of daily practice to get a good technique established, so be patient, and hang in there!

Next: The embouchure

:slight_smile:

27

I started working with Laura at the beginning of my senior year in high school. I have only had about two years of previous private instruction and therefore had a lot of bad habits that needed to be corrected! I was amazed at Laura’s ability to hear the most intricate details in the music and give instant feedback that was helpful in order to correct every mistake and refine the piece that I was working on.

williamgeorge
consumer generated media

28

To williamgeorge

Sorry ..who is Laura ??

B

29

@ Ballygo

I added a couple of edits to my earlier post.

And, seeing as all of this classical technique stuff could lead to some questions, naturally, I’ll be right here.

After all, I did say that this could lead to some conversation.

:wink:

30

As play a lot in both session and concert , I find myself searching for the safe haven of the pipers grip when the going get´s rough. I hope Im not just fighting against the inevitable . Im still taking the advise which I very much appreciate , as I know this is a good way.

B[/i]

31

You could be an exception, of course, but it generally takes considerably more than a few days to get the normal flute grip into something workable.

Meanwhile, you’ll be continuously refining it, including the slightest of adjustments, until you’ve found just what positions work best for you.

Meanwhile, your arms, hands, fingers, and chin will become ever more accustomed to those positions.

One day, perhaps soon, it will all come together.

Be patient, and hang in there!

32

Im making progress with the grip , although Im not using the normall grip on the right hand yet.

So , Embouchure please ( cork) :slight_smile:

33

Good! I’m glad to hear of your progress. The RH grip is an odd thing, the thumb in particular. I didn’t invent it, but that’s really how it goes. Again, its use is in helping to keep the wrist from turning sideways, as to “balance” the wrist. If you play with your thumb held out, to the side of your hand, for instance, you’ll see how the wrist wants to turn sideways, toward the foot end of the flute. Moreover, a balanced wrist very much helps to relieve muscle tension, which in turn allows for freer and faster finger articulation. Try it both ways, and see for yourself.

OK, on to the embouchure, but first I must excuse myself, as my time at the moment is limited, and I’ll try to return, soon.

Meanwhile, I have two questions, 1) is your embouchure suited to playing the flute, and 2) are you breathing correctly? These are matters we could discuss, but they are of importance. Not everybody has a “perfect” embouchure, but there are some ways to get around that, and correct breathing is simply a matter of doing it right.

See you soon!

34

This is a helpful post for me, as I am trying to teach myself to play the flute as well. The problem I am having is following the directions for the positions. Would it be possible to post some pictures of the positions you are describing? (i.e. the classical “up” positions and the “down” positions?)

I have also been playing with a pipers grip, which works for me since I have been playing pipes for a while, but I am more than happy to learn any way that could help me to improve.


thanks,

James

35

Hi,

The “up” position holds the flute at horizontal, flat out, parallel to the floor.

That’s where to begin, any other position being an alternative of that.

Please read the earlier posts of this thread, including all links.

After a long evening, however, I’ll return tomorrow.

Otherwise, let’s get on with it!

:slight_smile:

36

Im not sure what kind of embouchure I have , I do know I loose focus and sometime when I present the flute to the mouth it sounds great , next time bad. My breathing Im sure is not great. Having played pipes for so long , and not needing to take breaths , Im a bit lazy there , advise welcome.

I dont now recommend pipers grip. Ok it´s easy for us pipers , but I find it harder to find the correct position for embouchure , and even-though sometimes the tone is good , i find it slips again .

37

Don’t be too quick to throw out the pipers grip, Ballygo - it is used by lots of trad. flute players in Ireland. I’ve heard plenty of them and they have very solid tone.
I started out that way but changed to a more normal grip 'cos I found I was unreliably sealing the bottom three holes and my thumb was under more strain but that’s just me and my fingers.
It is a bit less stable and more balancy but perhaps the advantage of that is that it requires a lighter, more relaxed grip and tension is an enemy.
I don’t think your grip has much to do with embouchure and tone - I think that best comes from achieving some sort of balance between focusing your airstream and relaxing at the same time. Maybe this helps.

38

Thank´s flutered. I have just finished practicing. The problem for me with the normal grip is the top hand . Just very difficult to roll the b and after doing a bcd triplet It´s difficult to relocate the holes again. I have no problem doing this with the pipers grip , and in fact tonight it was much better than normal grip, and the flow of the music is great. I am expecting a 6 key flute in the post any day now. I want to use the keys , so the normal grip is attractive. It´s getting better with the normal grip , but the temptation to go the pipers route is always there. I am depressed and cant make the choice. I suppose I will keep going just to say I gave the normal grip a chance.

B

39

Apparently pipes, and later whistles, those instruments which are held more or less out to the front of a player, have an older and more established history in Ireland than that of the transverse flute. So, it seems likely that the established techniques for playing those instruments could have carried over to the flute, hence, the use of the piper’s grip on the flute.

Talasiga is another member of the C&F board, and where he comes from the bansuri is a popular instrument. Well, it turns out that the bansuri is in many ways similar to a typical ITM flute, and, moreover, that the traditional bansuri grip appears quite similar to the traditional piper’s grip, and has an ancient history, too. So, indeed, the piper’s grip apparently is not out of the running. You might send a PM to talasiga (with a small “t”), and ask about the bansuri.

The transverse flute, however, is ancient, literally thousands of years old, and perhaps nobody could really know just where and when it was first developed, yet the known history of flute playing, in terms of technique, only goes back a few hundred years or so. During that time, moreover, certain techniques have evolved, and the techniques I have been speaking of are in accordance with that.

So, what to do?

Well, if traditional ITM technique could be a top priority, then perhaps a piper’s grip could be the thing to do. After all, it’s known to work.

Yet, there are alternatives.

I’d say to go with whatever technique makes the best sense to you. After all, it’s your world, it’s your flute, and it’s your music.

:slight_smile:

40

Cork. Ive not given up , in fact the normal grip is getting better for me , and I will continue. When you get time please talk about embouchure . I find you advise a great help , and cant thank you enough.

B