Hi all,
Just out of curiosity;
It is always said that a D whistle always plays naturally in 3 keys (Dmaj, Gmaj and Emin)
Dmaj: D, E, F♯, G, A, B, C♯, D
Gmaj: G, A, B, C, D, E, F♯, G
Emin: E, F♯, G, A, B, C, D, E
But what about D mixolydian?
Dmaj: D, E, F♯, G, A, B, C, D
And even F# Locrian
F# G A B C D E
it is easily playable on a whistle, but never mentioned. Why is this?
Cheers,
Erwin
Because if you start counting modes, then a D whistle naturally plays in 14+ “keys” and it’s just a pain in the neck to list them all.
Frankly, I wouldn’t list Emin separately like that … you either need more keys (after all, Bmin is every bit as natural a fit for a D whistle!) or fewer (I think just D and G would be my preference).
PS You’ve left out the super-common in Irish music A mixolydian and A dorian scales.
If you’re going to list the modes that Irish tunes on D whistles, pipes, and flute commonly occur in, off the top of my head it would be
D Major, D Mix
E dorian (actual E minor tunes are scarce, seems to me)
G Major (though some tunes or parts of tunes are in G Lydian)
A Mix, A dorian
B minor
C Lydian (a large number of old Highland Scottish tunes are in the equivalent key, G Lydian)
A separate issue, I suppose, are all the scales, the five-note and six-note “gap scales”.
Scales with a missing 3rd are neither Major nor minor, but are usually perceived by the listener to be minor. Many tunes which are listed as “minor” and guitarists accompany as minor don’t have a 3rd at all, and could be just as fittingly accompanied as Major.
I’m with colomon - D and G will do for me.
Mostly depends on whether you are a “lumper” or a “splitter”. But does it really matter? Just play the tune…
Best wishes.
Steve
Reminds me of the time, some years back, when I was trawling round nurseries looking for a Paeonia Lithophila. Eventually, at about the 10th nursery I came to, I asked the man serving (who turned out to be the owner) and his immediate response was, “Are you a lumper or a splitter?” I got my plants. 
A little more inclusive but almost as simple: “anything with one or two sharps in the key signature”.
Yep. That works.
Thanks for all the info.
I normally just play the tune from memory and hearing as well
But just started to go a bit more into the background as I am trying to pick up the flute again. I just started wondering
I am still trying figure out why to call something A Dorian instead of G Major, as they are clearly related (1 sharp), currently looking at Humours of Tuamgreine.
Tuamgraney Castle resolves on A. The note a tune resolves on is usually a good indicator of the key.
What key is the slide “Get Up Old Woman and Shake Yourself”? 
I guess it is technically hexatonic, but there are just some tunes like this that I have a hard time putting a label on.
Personally I’d say it was in G, but you could easily argue that it’s in E minor.
I think e dorian, but it revolves around some different notes during, and that is what throws me off. It just feels mixy or dorian. I wonder if the missing c makes it feel different enough to confuse me?
Sounds to me like you’ve got it about right. It does move around a bit.
Myeh.
If you can name ány key or scale or mode, you can play it on ány whistle. Don’t let all the “three-key-only-folks” mislead!
As an engineer, I’m always trying to figure out underlying structure of things, and asking “why”. Music is so full or interesting and beautiful patterns.
I didn’t really “get” modes until I realized that they follow a cycle of “fifths” within a particular key signature. So, in the key signature of G with one F#, you have the G-major, D-Mix (up 5 notes), A-Dorian and E-minor. E-minor is the relative minor of G-major, so I think of A-Dorian as the relative dorian of G, an D-Mix, the relative Mixolydian of G.
To my ears, Mixolydian feels “major-ish”, and Dorian feels “minor-ish”, so the cycle of modes fits how the music feels.
It’s interesting how many almost E-minor tunes lack the conviction of going totally minor, and throw in an ambiguous C# note.
When I accompany on guitar, knowing the mode is helpful. The mode of E-minor has two sharps, but the mode of E-Dorian has only one. So in an E-dorian tune, I wouldn’t normally want to use an A-minor or C-Major chord because the C-natural isn’t part of the key signature. Or in G-major, I might swap in the relative E-minor for the G-major chord or the relative A-minor for the C-chord.
That C# note is just part of the mode of E Dorian.
You have those key signatures the wrong way round - E minor (Aeolian, if you like, or so-called ‘natural minor’) has one sharp, whereas E Dorian has two sharps.
A lot of guitarists use so-called modal chords, i.e., no 3rd, to accompany music of this sort, especially when using DADGAD tuning.
(Warning: There are some lively discussions on the internet (thesession, e.g.) about the meaning of the term “modal chord”, or whether it’s a legitimate term at all.)
Yes when I was doing lots of studio work on uilleann pipes I learned that I had to be clear about what the pipes did. Beforehand over the phone I would tell the composer “one or two sharps, G Major or D Major, range from the D above Middle C to the A an octave and a half above that.”
But talking to composers is like talking to bricks. At one gig I showed up to find that he had written my music in flats. I said I couldn’t play it. He said “over the phone you said G”. The piece was in G minor. 
I’m going to give this a try. Might be too much, but if you get something out of it, awesome. I think it helps that I play piano because I can see everything laid out on a keyboard. I’m not going to go into anything too complex because I still sometimes have trouble remembering these things, and I studied them. I’ve always wondered why whistles were made in so many keys, and I suspect it has much to do with the limited (2 octaves plus a bit more if get creative) range you get on each instrument.
If you simply look at written music, the number of flats or sharps will give you the key signature only, but unless you specify whether it’s a major or minor scale, that could cause confusion. The link below to the circle of fifths that was mentioned above by tstermitz will at least give an idea of first what to look for in terms of key signatures with the major scales and the relative minor scales.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Relative_key#/media/File:Circle_of_fifths_deluxe_4.svg
In the case of a D whistle, it’s keyed in the D major scale (D-E-F#-G-A-B-C#-D) with its relative minor scale B. Diatonic refers to the specific spread of 5 whole steps and 2 half steps (or semitone) in pitch across the octave. For D major, you have semitones between the 3rd (F#) and 4th (G), then between the 7th (C#) and the 8th (D). Then we get into modes. In the D mixolydian mode, you end up with a flatted 7th so that C# becomes C, and you end up with only the one sharped F. This is the same key signature for G major with relative minor E. Speaking of E minor, E Dorian is essentially the E minor scale with a sharped 6th (C to C#). Thus, you get the same key signature as the D major scale again. If you read through the link below, there are more details. In terms of modes, the major scale is the Ionian mode, and the relative (natural) minor is the Aeolian mode. Yes, I had to look these up again because I could not remember the names, only the theory behind them. As a side note, the natural minor is the true relative minor of a particular key signature. Harmonic and melodic minor scales involve changes to specific notes that would change the key signatures, even though the first note of the scale (tonic) remains the same. I mixed these up a lot when I was taking piano as a kid.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diatonic_scale
Realistically, on a D whistle, you can easily play any of the key signatures / modes that use the two octaves of the notes D-E-F#-G-A-B-C#-D, and C with oxxooo or oxxxoo fingering. Other flats or sharps require half-holing or some creative fingering and checking with a tuner; I would recommend half-holing as I found that to be more accurate in terms of the pitch. But if you do anything other than the D major, or even the E minor or Dorian, but anything else will limit the the number of upper notes you can play in those scales/modes/whatever you want to call them.