I recently purchased a Susato Oriole Bb whistle and found it tends to clog after 3 to 4 minutes of playing. For a few years, I have been playing several whistles with either plastic or plastic/metal head having either straight or curved windway but did not experience such clogging before.
I searched here but could find only one thread discussing on clogging in Susato whistles. Rather, I found many threads where people recommend Susato whistles to the original posters who complain about clogging of their whistles.
So I am quite curious about my current situation and wish to hear your thoughts.
Thanks for your input.
–I am sure that the whistle is already warm enough.
–I do not think about using Duponol or soap.
“soup” … that’s a novel solution, I quite like artichoke soup
Anyway … any whistle I think has the capacity to clog, it all depends upon the circumstances. Temperature is a big one, but I suppose some players may be “wet” players so to speak.
I play a lot outdoors, often with aluminium whistles at low temperatures (3 or 4 degrees centigrade) which according to many must lead to disaster. I doesn’t and I suppose I’ve also learned a few tricks.
On one whistle it is definately the washing up liquid one, a drop down the windway when I wash the whistle (I smear it in with a bit of flat plastic cut from an old plastic card). I also notice that I have the habit of occasionally sucking up the windway which helps too. I only noticed that I do it when someone mentioned it on this forum.
Does this help? Well, the answer may be to try the washing up liquid method and think about developing the other habit too.
When I get a new whistle, any whistle, it tends to be more clog-prone than my older whistles. The more I play and get to know the whistle, the less it clogs. The dish soap treatment which the previous poster mentioned does work. But for me, the more I get to know the whistle, the less it clogs, even taking into account the fact that some whistles are more clog-prone than others. As an aside, when I am trying to learn a new tune, it tends to clog more, perhaps because I am learning the breath points as I go along. I had a Susato Oriole C some time ago; it wasn’t cloggy at all.
ecadre,
Thank you for pointing out my mistake of spelling. I have corrected it.
I understand what you experienced and what you have been trying but I also know that some whistles never have a trouble of clogging.
I think trying to manage the easy-to-clog whistle is not the way to go. We should complain about its clogging and ask the maker to improve their instruments. We actually know the famous maker who changed his beak design constructed with metal to that with Delrin.
Some of my never-clogging whistles are equipped with full-Delrin head and curved windway, so I just expected the same to my Oriole but it was not the case. I will just move it to my drawer.
Tyler DelGregg,
Thank you for let me know your observation on new whistles and new tunes. I wonder that such psychological factors certainly raise our body temperature and thus increase amount of water in our breath.
And thank you for reporting your experience on your Oriole. I was expecting to have the same on mine but did not.
Puipui, interesting point you make about the delrin heads with curved windways. They really do resist clogging. I have 5 Reyburns, all with delrin heads and they are the most clog-resistant whistles I have ever played. (and nice sounding too)
I’m always a little uncertain about proper protocols before making my first post on a forum. So here’s hoping this question is in the right place.
I’m very new to the tin whistle, owning (so far) only a Clarke D and C, A Feadog D, and a Susato Oriole high D. I recently ordered a Bb body for the Oriole, as I would like an instrument in a little lower register. Opinions here regarding the sound and voicing of the Oriole Bb seem varied.
So just wondering if the forum has come to anything like a consensus regarding the overall sound and quality of the Oriole Bb as compared to more expensive Bb whistles. I should be in a position to form my own opinion very soon, albeit a very inexpert one. I deliberated quite a bit before ordering the Oriole body instead of the Dublin or even Kildare Bb. If nothing else, I want to try the finger hole spacing on a Bb whistle before spending a little more.
Inthevale – I, too, am new, and I took a leap and ordered two Generation Bb, one brass and one nickel-plated, from an online store. I spent $11 and $12 dollars each, and they are very playable for a beginner. For a pretty cheap price, they helped me realize that I can, indeed, finger a Bb. Although not as good as my two better whistles, they are pretty decent for the price.
For the OP and everyone else… thanks so much for contributing to this forum; your questions, answers, and experiences are quite valuable.
Thank you for your inputs.
I am happy if my inexpert post encouraged you to post your first one.
My first post was at the end of last October, so I am also new here.
Days ago, I was vacantly looking at the head of my Oriole.
I noticed that its windway floor has a step of about 0.5mm high.
I brought the head under a microscope and began inspecting it.
It seems the head of Oriole is constructed of 6 little plastic pieces and they are glued together.
But, it is in a really clumsy manner.
I could see glue bulging out unseemly here and there. Large burrs were left un-treated on some parts.
As a whole, the parts look improperly joined together.
I now understood this improper construction caused the step on windway floor.
I believe this step induced a disturbance in airflow, and made it difficult to blow out condensation in the windway.
I have received a replacement from the dealer.
The head of the replacement is much more neatly constructed than the previous one. I could not find any glue bulging out.
I checked its windway floor and no step found. I put the head on a finger tube and started playing.
Yes! no clogging!
Just tried out the Oriole Bb body with the original head. It sounds pretty fair to my ear. And again, I am a newbie to tin whistle. Some of the upper register notes seem a little flat. I understand this is a common issue with a cylindrical bore flute ? I am also having to exercise very careful breath control at the lowest note, as my Oriole breaks into upper octave more easily than my other whistles (including the Oriole using the D body).
The head slipped off with less friction than I would have guessed. It’s not hard to imagine the need for a little teflon tape in the future. But no problems with it for now, anyway.
And last but not least–reaching the bottom finger hole is going to be a bit of a work in progress for me. I am wondering if that spacing tends to be closer on tapered whistles ?
Anyway, I am guessing the Oriole is a good value for the price. I do like the richer sound of Bb vs D for the kind of tunes I am limited to playing for now.
It will do because it’s got a narrower bore-to-length ratio as a Bb at the same bore as the D. I think the Oriole probably plays best as a C. It’s still nice as a laid-back Bb, but getting raucous higher up as a D and (especially) an Eb.
How about to try holding the Bb-Oriole with your right hand in slightly different way, that is from obliquely above. You will not worry about the span of your fingers in this oblique positioning. And you will use slightly proximal part of your index and middle fingers to cover corresponding holes.
–the lowest note
As explained in the above post by Peter Duggan, D-Oriole and Bb-Oriole have different playing characteristics based on the physical properties of their finger-tubes, even if sharing the same head.
I recommend you to concentrate on playing your Bb-Oriole without going back and forth between D- and Bb-. This will help your brain to complete much earlier a new table of blowing parameters for playing notes in Bb-Oriole.
–upper register notes
As far as I found in searching through this forum, it seems that you just have to blow more to reach proper upper notes in Susato whistles. Many are saying that it is sometimes to the extent which you have to worry about noxious effects on your ears. And I suppose that this is one of the reasons why some (many?) people do not like Susato whistles.
However, I am wondering that Bb-Oriole may escape from such widely distributed rumors.
Characterization of Bb-Oriole by Peter Duggan in his post above also encouraged me.
Let us see the truth after several weeks of practice for taming Bb-Oriole.
Yes. Practicing the same tune in flutes of different keys is added confusion for the beginner like myself. Maybe practice the slower tunes in Bb and the ones I need to step up in speed on my D’s ?
The breath control for breaking registers in various flutes is a confusing variable as well. I’m a long way from being able to knock out a piece like “Two Hornpipes” , or a good fast reel. So sticking with one flute for practice here sounds like the way to go. There are times when my Clarke and Feadog seems to break too easily, then there are times when I could swear the Susato is downright ornery in that respect.
This stimulated me to purchase an additional D-body in order to confirm that “raucous” higher notes with my ears.
After that, I noticed the D-Oriole looks quite similar to my Dixon ABS whistle. Dixon has the same bore size and outer diameter as those of Oriole but is free from raucous higher notes.
I wonder that if Susato designers had chosen a slightly different head design, D-Oriole could have been more user-friendly. Why did they aim at C-whistle players?
I doubt they did. They simply needed one head and bore size to cover four pitches from Eb to Bb, which is quite a tall order. You’d probably find that a head voiced more for the shorter whistles here wouldn’t support the Bb lower range adequately.
I have used some poster putty for that and did not get any shrillness up to the third octave D.
Because of lack of precision in a process of gluing its small parts together, there are some variations among Oriole heads.
So, I will not mind what others are writing about the Oriole.
My Oriole Bb is genial and its notes sound quite natural.
It is trustworthy without sudden raucousness.
It is free of clogging.
I like my Oriole Bb very much.
The Instruction Book they prepared for this set is as thick as 74 pages.
It seems that they really concentrated their efforts on this set.
Thus, the Oriole head had to be tuned up to the key of C, I guess.
Oriole whistles might be merely the side-products.
Another thing interested me is the relation between Oriole and Dublin whistles.
Orioles were put into the Dublin line as temporal alternatives of the forthcoming tunable new Dublin whistles.
If this aspect was the main purpose of Susato, the Oriole head should be tuned up to the key of D as Bb Oriole was not necessary.
There was a Bb Dublin whistle already.
It’s equally possible they chose C for that set because their one-size-fits-all Oriole whistle head and tube diameter were playing best in C?
Orioles were put into the Dublin line as temporal alternatives of the forthcoming tunable new Dublin whistles.
Haven’t heard of forthcoming tunable Dublins. But I do have older (presumably Dublin) non-tunable Susatos in D and C and would say the D of that design is a much better whistle than the Oriole D whereas I probably prefer the Oriole C to my older C. I don’t have any Kildares.
A whistle designer will tune up his whistle prototype to play best in the key of D, if no special request
was given beforehand. Because he knows whistles in the key of D sell more than those of other keys.
Dublin s-series and Kildare s-series were shown up as expected.
For the people living outside of the “whistle world”, key of C is much more friendly than other keys.
Two sharp marks at the top of music sheets of whistle tunes are really a high barrier for them.
So I think Susato have chosen the key of C for this set on purpose.
