I’d be much obliged if some of you could help a newbie with a couple of questions. I’m brand new to the flute but have been a professional trombonist for 30+ years and have been involved in ITM as a whistle player for about three years. My search for a teacher continues but I’m hoping you all can save me from possibly developing some bad habits.
Question the first; as a whistle player I find half holing the C natural (all comments here apply to D instruments) to be a lot easier than cross fingering. It also seems more natural on my keyless M&E. In order to have the freedom to roll L1 enough to half hole, I have seem to need to have my thumb under the flute and supporting it. I keep seeing and reading about being able to support the instrument without the left thumb at all, but any scheme I’ve tried that uses part of L1 for support doesn’t let me roll the finger easily. Am I missing something here, or should I just learn to love cross fingering?
Question the second; brass players need to increase air speed to reach higher notes. What we are taught is to arch the tongue to narrow the venturi. If you blow a continuous stream of air and alternate between saying “tuu” and “tee” you’ll get the idea. It seems to work for me going into and up the second octave. However, the only reference I was able to find concerning this and flute playing implied that it was a bad idea. It said arching the tongue will make the tone fuzzy, which I’ve not noticed. Is this a technique I should leave in my trombone case?
Your collective wisdom will be valued and appreciated.
Desperately need the good karma, so let me give it a try.
Second first, following Denny. The principle is that of the garden hose, which
squirts the water further and faster when one narrows the aperture with
one’s thumb. The lips making a smaller aperture makes the stream of air
faster for the same reason. It will take awhile to get a strong enough
embouchure to do this, but it will come.
It’s OK to use the thumb to steady the flute when you are half-holing.
That doesn’t mean you always need to use it. Occasional use
for a special purpose is OK.
Also you are likely
to find you can role L1 over with less use of the thumb as
you get the hang of holding the flute. These things tend
to sort themselves out. The body figures things out.
The more ways you know how to play C natural the better.
So you ought to learn cross fingering too.
On my keyless flute I have a thumb hole put in so I can
play C natural that way too. There are lots of fingerings/passages
where alternate ways of playing C natural come in
handy. Especially at speed.
Now maybe, just maybe, I won’t be reborn as a frog.
Hi, and welcome to the Chiff & Fipple Flute Forum!
Half-holing is something of an art, to begin with, and half-holing the L1 hole in particular could also conflict with the grip used to hold the flute. Now, if you can find a way to successfully half-hole with L1, then fine, great and congratulations. However, because the required shifting of that finger to half-hole just might also affect the LH grip on the flute, especially in a situation where a lot of such L1 half-holing gets done over the course of a tune, I’d say to keep the cross-fingering option available, just in case. BTW, there are a variety of Cnat half-holing fingering options, where oxx ooo is traditional, but there are other fingerings which can produce a “cleaner” tone, too.
As far as air speed goes, yup, the same applies to the flute, the higher the tone, the faster the required air speed, in general, and vice versa. However, as has already been said, the tongue does not have a role in the speed of the air stream, as that’s all done by a coordinated effort of the upper and lower lips, collectively known as the embouchure. The tongue sometimes does have a role in the articulation of tones, but perhaps less so in the playing of Irish Traditional Music, ITM.
And some flutes produce a better note using one method than with others, and you’ll find that you vary according to the length or importance of the note.
I found that gradually the “this flute is trying to jump out of my hand” feeeling faded without any attention from me, apart from consciously trying to model my grip on the diagram in Hammy’s Irish Flute Player’s Handbook. One day it just worked, and despite taking extended breaks from fluting, that part at least was like riding a bike–right there when I wanted it again. Enbouchure, not so much.
And here I thought I was never going to be able to agree with Cork on a matter of embouchure, but it seems it’s all very flexible, just as it should be.
Flexible and powerful, just like my favourite
whisky
Hi MikeS:
If you have some Good Karma still available, I’d like to welcome you as I am switching over to flute myself, (although I am coming from experience playing wind instruments, not brass as yourself). I do remember a kid in high school who was first chair trumpet, later took up jazz flute in college and became a top notch professional jazz flutist, so maybe their is a brass to flute good karma thing. Wish you good luck and lots of fun learning and playing. And don’t hesitate to go to sessions, the folks are great, the music is great, and the pints cold and tasty!
Now, if you can please manage to send some good karma to the UPS delivery truck that’s been driving back and forth by my town for 2 days with my brand new flute in it, that would be wonderful! The poor flute will be radioactive from all the times its been scanned by the time I recieive it!
There are many ways to hold a flute, many of which involve the left thumb. If it’s easier for you to use a grip involving the left thumb, go ahead and do it.
Thanks for all the good advice. The relationship between air speed and aperture is a little different on brass instruments. I think this is mostly due to the higher back pressure on brasses. I’m still sorting through it but the learning process is always fun.
I’m not so much switching as trying to add another arrow to the quiver. The hope is that my own Karma with the flute OK since I usually sit behind the violas. The job of making the flute player’s lives a living hell is generally the realm of the trumpeters.
Ticks. Why did you have to say ticks?
I hadn’t thought of that.
Yeah, Mike, it’s the lips and the size and configuration of the
aperture hole, and it takes awhile. Very satisfying and expressive
once you get it.
Hope you stay with us.
Please, I’m a trombone player who doubles on tuba. Trumpet players are another species entirely. To effectively stereotype brass players it’s helpful to examine what constitutes a typical joke for each. Trumpet player jokes tend to revolve around ego and, to a lesser extent, volume.
Q: How many trumpet players does it take to change a light bulb?
A: Fifty. One to do it while the others discuss how they would have done it differently and ever so much better.
Tuba player jokes tend to center on alcohol consumption.
Q: How many tuba players does it take to change a light bulb?
A: At least five. One to hold the bulb in the socket while the others drink until the room begins to spin.
French horn players can tend to get lost in the esoterica of their craft. To a horn player, the best sort of joke is one that makes no sense to anyone but another horn player.
Q: How many horn players does it take to change a light bulb?
A: It depends. Does the socket have an Alexander or a Lawson thread?
Trombone player jokes, for some reason, center on the difficulty of finding anyone silly enough to hire you.
Q: What’s the difference between a dead squirrel on the side of the road and a dead trombonist on the side of the road?
A: The squirrel might have been on its way to a gig.
Q: How do you improve the aerodynamics of a trombone player’s car?
A: You take the Domino’s sign off the roof.
I’m betting there are similarities in the ITM world, but all I’ve tuned into so far is everyone wincing when someone shows up with a bodhran.
