[article] Traditional songs out of tune with today's kids

Whistle
1

This was an article in today’s Chicago Tribune: the url is at http://www.chicagotribune.com/services/site/premium/access-registered.intercept but you have to logon to read the story.

According to the author, Marilyn Ward, a lot of kids are more familiar with the top 40 than with songs like Old MacDonald. Quoting 7 year old Shawna Bramlett, age 7, “I listen to nothing but the top 40. Eninem really speaks to me. Old music is for old people.”

Ward did a survey last spring, looking at the use of traditional children’s songs in public school curriculum. Some of the replies from music teachers were “My school is low socio-economic, so I teach only pop music.” “Our curriculum is multi-cultural. We do not teach songs of the American culture.” “These songs aren’t in my textbooks, so I don’t teach them.” Teachers also thought that about 5% to 15% of their students could sing from memory songs such as “Twinkle, Twinkle Little Star,” “Home on the Range,” or “The Farmer in the Dell.”

Although it’s certainly a good thing to incorporate children’s songs from other cultures, Ward raises a note of concern over the encroachment of popular culture into what young children are being raised on. Ward quotes Diane Kresh, director of Public Service Collections in the Library of Congress:

Teaching traditional songs in school allows children, at an early
age, to discover and explore who we are as a nation, our roots
and development. Traditional songs reflect who we are and
where we came from, the cultures that influenced us, our
feelings about what it means to be an American, the small
details of everyday life and customs, our industries and
agricultural heritage, the romance of the West, and the
pioneering spirit that moved us to cross mountains in covered
wagons to build new lives and communities.

According to Ward, “Without taking deliberate steps to preserve them (i.e., traditional songs), educators and musicologists believe, it won’t be long before these kinds of musical and cultural ties to the past disappear.” Quoting John Feierabend, chair of the music education division of the Hartt School of the University of Hartford in Connecticut, “As a country becomes more commercially centered, it loses some of its respect of its heritage. Some Europeans refer to our culture as the ‘Coca-Cola’ culture: All things are commercialized.”

As I read this article, I thought of how easy it would be to introduce the tin whistle to music education in primary schools, and how so many of the available tutorials have a number of children’s songs that are easy to learn and play. The Generation G whistle would work well – inexpensive and just the right size for small hands. Bill Och’s tutorial would be ideal for U.S.A. schools since it incorporates a number of American traditional songs. The Mel Bay tutorial also has a number of easy songs familiar to this country.

Last year I talked with our daughter’s kindergarten teacher about this idea, using the tin whistle in early children’s music education. She was very interested, wanted to know more about the Ochs tutorial, and all the kids wanted to try the Generation G whistle I had with me. I think if I really want to push this idea, I should show the Tribune article to the school principle and then talk about the whistle. Think I’ll do this once school break is over . . .

Any parents on this list who like this idea? Let’s start a whistle revolution!

– Dan M.

2

I like the idea.

Unfortunately, “political correctness” is the culprit behind much of the disappearance of traditional music from the classroom. When I was teaching music at my daughter’s school last year, my co-teacher and I went through some of the school songbooks from our generation (the early '70s in my case and the mid-'60s in her case) and realized that we wouldn’t be ALLOWED to teach much from those texts, lest one person or another take offense. It was very disheartening. FWIW, however, the kids got a real kick out of Irish music when I played it for them, so I like the whistle idea a lot.

Redwolf

3

Well I’m afraid that you can’t really rely on public schools to teach a child much of anything beyond reading, writing, and arithmetic (and even then, I wouldn’t take it on faith), so if mom and pop don’t want the granola crew to brainwash their child, it’s up to them to take care of the culture/morals part…

Also, who the hell lets a 7 year old listen to eminem?!? WTF??

4

I read this article this morning in the Trib, and it greatly saddened me. However, I really don’t think it’s the schools to blame - only partly at the most. I was lucky to have pretty good music programs in the schools I went to, but I still learned more traditional songs at my mother’s knee than in school. (And I remember the ones I learned from my mom more too). Kids spend a lot more time at home than in school. But, when all the parents are listening to is Eminem, that’s what the kids learn.

The other thing that scared and saddened me in that article was the responses of the teachers when asked why they don’t teach more traditional songs. I greatly admire and respect teachers for what they do (I know I couldn’t do it), but when you hear answers like those, I fear for what at least some kids are learning (or more specifically NOT learning).

Beth

5

My wife teaches third grade. She has got a better handle on this subject than me. What I understand is here in California the push is always on the state testing and what the state pushes for curiculum. The state has the money. The better the test scores the more funding the district gets. If the scores are not up to par then the district/school loses funding. My wife is required to teach certain reading and writing scripts called Open Court. The district selects specific curiculum in the core subjects and dictates the hours taught in that subject and how it’s taught. Subjects like music, sports, science and others are an after thought. Education must be handled at home. Culture begins at home. School is never a substitute for bringing to our children our values and experience. WE can’t be too busy not to take care of our own.

Just my opinion, do all you can. It’s not a hopeless cause.
Jon

6

I enjoyed reading all the responses to the original post except Telegraph Sam’s. I don’t know where he went to school, but to extrapolate from a sampling of one school (his own?) to a cavalier dismissal of the effectiveness of the entire American education system is a cheap shot at best. I happen to be a music teacher in Massachusetts. In middle school we teach piano/ keyboarding skills, Jazz and the Harlem Renaissance, percussion, music research and tin whistle among other things. It has been a lot of fun. However, it’s getting harder and harder to provide this kind of instruction because of the increasing demands of the state test (MCAS). The kids in our school have always done well on standardized tests and yet we are subject to the same state test as underperforming school systems. The results are that schools are now teaching to the test and eliminating many of the “frills” that Sam seems to think are incompatible with “readin’ and writin’.” Great idea: let’s get rid of all the stuff that makes school fun so we can concentrate exclusively on the basics. That’ll teach those granola-heads to toe the line!

7

  1. If you’re going to insult me, at least get my bloody name right.

  2. If you’re going to insult me, at least make a half-assed attempt at understanding my basic argument. My complaint was that the granola-heads were getting rid of the “frills” or otherwise making the “frills” so political that the kids are robbed of their own cultural identity, not that I condoned getting rid of them. Also, my opinion is not simply based on one school. I’ve discussed this exact issue with numerous people from varied backgrounds. Many agree wholeheartedly that the public schooling in this country leaves much to be desired.

  3. The school I went to had a music program, and an excellent band director. I’m merely saying that it’s not really the school’s responsibility, and that parents should raise their own damn children instead of expecting the teachers, the radio, the television, and everyone else to. If you don’t see why I get upset, just think back to the whole debacle following the Columbine shootings. Everyone was so quick to pass the buck onto music and video games, oh no, it COULDN’T have possibly been the fault of the parents or community or, gasp the two boys themselves.

8

Exactly why I am homeschooling…I’m happy to say that my kids will not be like those in the story who do not know traditional songs. :slight_smile:

Best,
Andrea

9

No seven-year-old said the sentences “I listen to nothing but the top 40,” or “Eminem really speaks to me.”

10

What I understand is here in California the push is always on the state testing and what the state pushes for curiculum. The state has the money.

Thats correct here also and it’s sad. The first half of the school year is spent studying for the tests so the schools rank higher and thus receive more money.

11

music in school should be fun and relaxing. but if the kids really want to learn to play, i don’t think most schoolteachers are qualified.
i believe it would be best to have several musicians to choose from, each teaching their own style of music. like one teacher only teaches top 40 songs, the other only classical music. after a year, you should be able to choose if they still want sheet music or not. this will result into a lot of different classes, but it could be done. famous musicians are earning a lot of money, so besides their income taxes, they should be forced to teach the kids :devil:

12

Out of curiosity, does anyone know how traditional music is taught in Ireland? There are the local musicians, gatherings at the pub and so on, but are there formal educational curriculums in the public schools?

– Dan M.

13

Tin whsitle is part of the music curriculum in the National School. It depends a bit on the teachers from school to school how well and intensive music is taught. A lot of traditional musicians are in the teaching profession and they in a lot cases give a wonderful musical education. Wellknow is the work of Frank Custy who passed on a lot of music in his national school and started an immense number of wellknown musicans off [concertinaplayer Yvonne Griffin is now teaching in his school so that work continues], in East Clare fiddle player Maeve Donnelly does an awful lot of work within her school and there are loads of similar examples of teachers passing on music within the NS system.
Some examples of music in schools are at the link www.ictclare.com

Other than that there’s private tuition, here in Miltown Malbay Brid Donohue teaches the whistle [she organises classes privately] and turns out lovely musicians. I was at the christmas concert of her pupils a few weeks ago and she had 150 players on stage [mostly local children and this is a town of about 1000 people]from the age group between 5 and 17, wonderful players all. A young girl in her teens teaches the concertina to at least twenty kids from the locality, another five or so including my own son travel to get lessons from Noel Hill, I have several young pipers coming to me, young fiddleplayers are being taught.

A lot of parents enrol their kids for classes during summerschools, during fleadhs and festivals etc. Music is passed on within families, among neighbours, there’s an awful lot of activity.

Another local initiative here is the Ceol na nOg, the young people’s music, a session again organised by Brid Donoghue, for her whsitle students, their friends and who ever wants to come [in the agegroup from 5-18]. They play, dance a few sets and every time there’s a ‘mystery guest’. An estblished musician who talks about his or her music, sings songs or plays some tunes and then plays with the group. It’s an immensely popular feature of the session and it is a great opportunity for the young ones to meet older musicians and play and talk with them. Eamonn Cotter, Paddy Canny, Paul Dooley, Dympna O Sullivan, Jackie Daly and many others have participated in this.

[edited several times to fix the inevitable typos]

14

The American society sucks… what can I say. My generation and the generations younger than me are all MADE, ENGINEERED and CONDITIONED to be stupid. They are not suppost to, and do not think for themselves. They do what the tv tells them to. It’s quite frightening really. But I wonder who wants a few generations of happy CONSUMERS who cannot think for themselves? I wonder…

Blame it on the baby boomers.

15

The American society sucks…

Dang, Jack. I see your point. Big money interests have a lot to do with all that. I’m always amazed when I hear how a marketing campaign by Nike or Pepsi gets a celebrity to do some endorsements/commercials, etc and market share goes up. It’s fascinating to me how that works and how much people are like sheep in so many ways. Product placement in movies and tv…etc…it works. I won’t go into politics, here. That’s the really scary part.

At the same time, there are pockets of people doing all kinds of things under the radar. Look at the Chiff gathering we had in Nov. My neighbor, Nirman, heard from someone at the hairdresser’s about a group of people who gather at someone’s house for basically, a Turkish music session. Now, she’s in it. She also has McCullough’s session book and is learning Irish tunes on her mandolin.

As far as raising kids goes, it’s truly up to the parents. I’m not sure what to say about the school’s responsibility. I heard tell of a grade school teacher who advised a parent about a disruptive child. The parent’s response was ‘he’s your problem when he’s at school. Don’t want to hear about it.’ Now, what do you do? Then, having worked with ‘severely emotionally disturbed’ kids (a legal term), I realize how many kids are walking around just waiting for a prison term to come along and they don’t have a large amount of control over the situation. Yeah, the human race is no joke. Not for wimps. Ultimately, you have to ask yourself what responsibility you have for society and what can you do to improve it.
Tony

16

One point that seems to be missing from this exchange is the issue of underfunding for schools. All over the country music, art, and athletic programs are being cut because voters won’t come up with the bucks to pay for our children’s educations. And, as we all should know by now, you get what you pay for.

17

Yup Tony, that’s why I’m a poli science major :slight_smile: Are yup there are good things about our society as well. One of the most amazing things to me is that I hardly ever meet a person that I don’t like and everybody seems to be pretty good people yet these problems persists and don’t get any better. Jon the problem is morons!!! (Well maybe not a moron but he’s a bad man and is following his own agenda) like Bush cut social funding and then RAISE military spending, which has been something that has been going on heavily sense Reagan but even before that. Even Ike Eisenhower warned against it… Ah, but I don’t want to talk politics. Well maybe I do.

And somebody mentioned the testing. Somehow the emphasis of schools in not to teach kids anything (I mean the kids don’t actually learn anything), but rather to make sure they pass some benchmark test so the district keeps the money. Some might not belive me but I know these tests are a republican plot to prove that our public schools are inept and failing (and they are right cause they are, but it’s not the schools fault, it’s societies) so that they can pass their voucher programs and privatize everything and have the government spend even less on improving our society. Believe it cause it’s true. America is full of cancer, and we need some good treatment soon.

18

I was wondering how long it would take to blame things on Bush and Republicans.

19

Geez, guys, you all are awfully pessimistic about today’s youth. I’m the first to admit that there are problems, major ones, with some segments of society apparently caught in a downward spiral of crime and poverty, and huge funding cuts in education and social programs. Our school district this year had to vote three times to pass the school budget, and the one that passed reflects huge cuts in staff. Our busing was also cut and some of us (me included) have to pay a fee for our children to ride the school bus.

That being said, we need to remember that it is the problems that make the news stories, not the good kids. I know 10 well adjusted kids for every child with problems and probably the same ratio for parents. This may or may not be the norm in the inner city, but at least in the smaller towns and suburbs, this seems to be the norm. I’m not sure what the population ratio is for inner city vs. suburb/town, but it seems at least to me that more people live outside the city than in it.

Also, it’s awfully easy to be critical of parenting until you have actually done it. Good parenting requires constant vigilance and time. For families where both parents work, some with more than one job per parent, it’s awfully difficult to introduce children to the joys of running loose through the hills when they are in after-school programs or camp. Families where one parent can stay home to enrich their children’s daytime hours are very fortunate. I know some of the people who posted here have kids and some don’t, but please try to visualize the whole ball of wax when judging a generation. Don’t make blanket statements that apply to some and not most.

As far as standardized testing, at least in our state, it seems to have gone too far. These kids start preparing for testing in the first grade, and I believe they don’t even take the first test until the third or fourth grade. Some of my daughter’s homework (and yes, she gets homework in the first grade–unheard of in my day!) is obviously meant to train children in how to fill out multiple choice questions in a testing format. Her teacher said to me that they spend so much time teaching towards testing that there is very little room for allowing children to follow their curiosity; this is a crying shame, because learning should be exciting. One sure way to kill a child’s enthusiasm is by drill. I don’t know what an alternative solution could be, but at least for successful schools, testing is more detrimental than helpful. Appropriate funding levels certainly would be more useful than expensive and time-consuming testing. And somehow engaging and educating parents in the learning process would be ideal.

Robin

20

If you don’t feel your child is getting the exposure you desire in certain areas at school, look for community or church based alternatives. We’re lucky enough to have a wonderful music program in our local public schools, but there are also community based bands that will teach children (or adults) to play an instrument and get them involved in playing with a group. Most of them are free to join, and some even provide the instruments.

Same goes for athletics, religious instruction, art, dramatics, etc. I think it’s great when schools can provide these things for our kids, but if they can’t, there are always alternatives. Let the schools focus on teaching kids to read and write, math skills, science and history.