I did not want to spend too much money. I’d like to know from Bansuri players: is it a big mistake to start with a “cheap” instrument ?
Is the Bansuri low B so dofficult to play? Any other suggestion opinion
is welcome ! Thanks.
As long as the tuning is ok you should be all right. But it is not the best size to start with as the finger stretch between the 2nd and 3rd holes is very wide and can cause injury if you are not careful. It is generally advisable to start with a smaller bansuri and work up as you become comfortable with the stretch. I guess just take it easy and do some finger stretching exercises might help out but you are right in that the deep tone is wonderful.
Have a look here for some info on the grips used -
The Bansuris that you buy in india can be very good and still cheap, but usually you do pay more if you buy one somewere else in the world. I belive it’s a good idea to buy directly from the maker, possibly a famous one, even if you pay more. Otherwise is mosty about luck, i belive. You might get a good one, or not. You’ll discover it soon
Playing a bansuri in the key of low B takes some practice. You should have at least medium size hands (that’s my case) and use piper’s grip. About air requirement… well, you don’t really need to blow hard, since you are not going to play it in a noisy session, are you?
Anyway if you practice enough you will get use to it
Thank you for your opinions. I know that to start with a low B bansuri is quite daring, but I already have a Doug Tipple low D flute and two low D Chieftain whistles, I thought that it could make sense to buy a bansuri in a key that
is one of the keys used in traditional Indian music, rather than have a “copy” of my current instruments. Regarding the quality, I don’t expect much for 65 dollars (the same bansuri in the key of low D is priced 35 dollars !) but on the other hand I am not expert enough to distinguish between good and bad
makers, and I did not want to spend $ 150/200 just guessing which of the
bansuri web stores really sells a good product !.
I have another question: I am used to six holes. Will the sevenbth hole make my life more complicate ? Also, where I can learn some basics ?
To update my original post - I meant the stretch between fingers 2 & 3 on holes 1 & 2. Don’t underestimate that stretch! It is more than most instruments I have played which ranges from long Basuri to long Shakuhachi.
That site I linked to will give you loads of basic information.
and have found them very good, selling top professional basuri. They sell six hole flutes as well. To be honest I stayed with the 6 holed ones myself finding the extra stretch for the little finger quite difficult. After all if they are good enough fro Pandit Hariprasad Chaurasia then they are good enough for me
Please see this bansuri topic
which may help you a little.
If you are performing a raag whose exposition requires a slide from the low augmented fourth interval to the perfect fifth (hindustani: from teevra Ma to Pa) then having that pinky hole makes things LESS complicated.
Anyway the extra hole (I call it the unreachable hole) comes as a pinky hole at 3 o’clock or as a lap hole on the underside at 6 o’clock. I believe Hariprasad and his school prefer the latter on their large flutes.
The finger stretch on my D Tipple measures for left hand:
top edge first hole to bottom edge third hole: 82mm (3 1/4 inches)
for right hand top edge fourth hole to bottom edge sixth hole: 78mm (3 1/16 inches).
On my B bansuri the respective measurements are:
top first to bottom third hole:100mm (3 15/16")
top fourth to bottom sixth hole: 98mm (3 13/16")
So i got about 20mm extra stretch for each hand plus an extra ca 45mm overall stretch because of the longer length.
It is quite a different beast then the Tipple D, and more comparable to a conical Bb flute in its stretch.
I am starting to think that perhaps I should have ordered a smaller bansuri to start ! On the other hand, the sound of a B bansuri is so deep and beautiful…
The apparency is shattered if one reads my post carefully.
A master bansuri player can utilise the “unreachable hole”. Even many beginners can. I cannot. Instead I need to meri to get the pinky note and that even on a smaller flute, namely low C# flute. None of the professional bansuri players I have met meri as far as I can see.
Gerardo, there is nothing barring you from having your low B bansuri and, perhaps also a D bansuri to train yourself up (or down) to the low B.
I made a long research on the web and (as a non-expert) this is what I understand: although bansuri indian flutes are made in different sizes, including small ones, the “real” bansuris that Indian professional play are quite bigger than the Irish flutes, which usually are in the key of low D.
The most common key is low B (tonic E) or even lower !
This is what gives to a bansuri its distinctive fascinating deep sound.
It’s the size, more than the design, that makes a difference between a bansuri and an Irish flute.
More over, even if the original bansuri flutes had six holes, most contemporary bansuri have seven holes.
Last but not least, I understand that the tuning could be a bit different from traditional western tuning. I was told that to a “western ear”, a bansuri could seem a bit out of tune.
But I am no expert, and it would be interesting to hear from someone with more knowledge.
In addition: Indian bansuris seem to have in general a bigger reach between fifth and sixth hole, because of a bigger sized sixth hole, to accommodate half-holing. Olwell bamboos seem to have a smaller sixth hole, closer to the fifth, and so are easier to finger.
Indian bansuris:
Olwell D bamboo (top)
(this was the only pic with an olwell bamboo I could find, dug out from the flute pic thread here, a most frustrating thread, since most pics posted have gone, leaving just comments like “gorgeous” below empty boxes)
I am not that knowledgeable about Indian bansuris, but here are the differences that I can see between professional-quality bansuris and bamboo Irish flutes. Some makers of bamboo flutes use bamboo with nodes along the length of the flute, whereas bansuris are made without nodes along the length of the flute. Pat Olwell’s bamboo flutes that I have seen and those pictured in this thread use a bamboo node for a stopper. The Indian bansuris pictured in the photo have tunable corks like a traditional Irish flute. The Harsh Wardham professional B bansuri that I owned (now owned by Hans in Scotland) was made from thin wall bamboo and, hence, was very light in the hands, whereas some bamboo flutes are made from heavier bamboo with thicker walls. Also, you will notice from the photograph of the group of Indian bansuris that the finger holes are not circular. Instead, being made by a hot poker moved from side to side, the finger holes are oval. This allows more control over slurs and microtones than completely round finger holes. An lastly, the bansuri, being made from a thin-walled cane or bamboo has a different embouchure than your typical Irish flute that has a much deeper embouchure chimney. Correct me if I am wrong here, but the bansuri’s shallow chimney embouchure makes it possible to play with more fluidity once your master the nuances of such an embouchure.
you perhaps have not checked out the info in this bansuri topic.
No one bansuri is more “real” than another when it comes to size. For a start the indic trad is a transposing trad meaning that anything and everything is transposed to a key suited to the singer (or instrument) and therefore those accopanying need to adjus6t constantly. Prior to the recent classisization of the bansuri it was the bansuris equal to and smaller than the D flute that were most common (and still are). It is only the classical tradition that sees a predominance of large flutes but this tradition is a very teeny weeny part of the WHOLE trad. And even in this portion the FOLK trad of bansuri is clearly acknowledged in performance, sourcing and diiscussion.
Most contemporary bansuris have only the six toneholes. Its only the classical bansuris that go for the pinky or lap hole.
There are issues of design that distinguish the north indian bansuri for other diatonic bamboo flutes. These are nicely explained by Doug Tipple.
yes, bansuris can often be tuned to a type of just Lydian intonation
from XXX OOO as opposed to an equal temperament Lydian from XXX OOO. In my experience this has never been a problem when playing with western music and I had discussed this in that other bansuri topic. (see link above).
The thing is that a classical bansuri is designed (with appropriate mastery of glissandi technique) to be able articulate every possible mode from XXX OOO or XXO OOO tonic with sliding technique including microtonal distinctions not possible on a keyed flute. (that is one of the hallmarks of mastery. I am not there yet.)
I will compare a keyed Irish D flute
and a D bell note bansuri (G tonic) .
The bansuri master (not me!) is playing two different Aeolian mode pieces wiith G tonic - raag Darbari and raag Jaunpuri.
Both have nominally the same scale of G natural minor (G Aeolian) namely,
G A Bb C D Eb F G+
The bansuri player has to “half hole” the following for the precise note that heshe needs:-
Bb C Eb and F.
Not only that, there are microtonal differences in the notes between these two raags. For instance, Darbari, a deep night raag, has a very flat minor third interval while Jaunpuri’s minor third is brighter. This means the half holing for the Bb in each of these raags will be DIFFERENT. Darbari’s Bb will sound flatter than than the Bb on a key mechanism articulated Bb and Jaunpuri’s may sound the same as the key mechaniism articulated Bb on the Irish flute or it may sound a tad sharper.
Thank you for all the info, Talasiga. You really know a lot about the subject !
By the way, I am used to six holes (Irish whistle and Irish flute).
Should I have ordered a six holes bansuri then ? Will it be difficult to adjust to seven holes ? I wonder if I can just use the first six holes and not use the seventh “pinky” hole as a start.
Last question first. Of course you can. I have done that for 30 years.
Will it be difficult to use the pinky? Depends on your hand size and the way your hand works etc etc.
Should you have ordered a 6 holer? No, it doesn’t matter. It is the same 6 digit technique whether you play Irish flute or whistle or bansuri. The pinky hole just gives you an option just like the low C# key on an Irish flute.
Be excited about your flute and enjoy.
The issue about whether you can use the pinky for the low note in CERTAIN raags is an issue that only comes as a demand for master bansuri players in highly refined classical performance.
woodflute mentioned One World Trading (http://www.one-world-trading.com/) as a source for bansuri. They certainly have a variety of offerings from various makers. I was wondering if woodflute or anyone else with experience of this company might have any comments to offer about the different flutes available there? Thanks.
